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Pankaja_Dasa

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Wishful thinking...does anyone back up their remarks with evidence from the sastas anymore ..or is it simply a free for all in encouragement in the preaching feild on a sentimental note ...

 

It seems to me that our Srila Prabhupada initially required 64 rounds but realizing our fallen condition reduced that number due to time and circumstance to 16 minimum, he must have known many of us would be on the links without enough time on our hands to chant. If I follow your philosophy I may give up chanting altogether and still go back home to Godhead...non ?

 

The ancient mariner should by all means be encouraged to chant as much as possible regardless playing golf ect.But the fact remains that the Lord Krsna and His eternal consort Sri Radha take greater notice if the aspirant sincerely makes his presence known by the glorification of their holy names.

 

Its like the difference between high spead internet and writing a letter by snail mail post,eventually it gets there but which is more expidient.." It is also commendable that he follows regulative priciples on his own regarding foodstuffs in the mode of ignorance, and his careful associations.

 

As far as the chanting goes Srila Prabhupad states "it is like the genuine cry of a baby for the mothers breast"

 

So to the degree one understands their suffering in the material world, the degree of seriousness in ones life unfolds in Krsna consciousness.

 

Vanmalli prabhu where do you find your comments substatiated in our Srila Prabhupada's books or internal instructions ?

 

yours in service...

 

gopijana das....

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The ancient mariner should by all means be encouraged to chant as much as possible regardless playing golf ect.But the fact remains that the Lord Krsna and His eternal consort Sri Radha take greater notice if the aspirant sincerely makes his presence known by the glorification of their holy names.

-------------------

 

Forgive me if I am wrong, but I am saying the exact same thing you are.

 

Read Ancient Mariner's original post. It sounds like he wanted to give up because "Prabhupada wouldn't accept him anyway" because he doesn't chant enough rounds.

 

Surely you agree that one round chanted is better than zero. Right?

 

My advice to him was, chant at least one to start! Then increase it.

 

rather than to think "well, I haven't succeeded yet, so I never will."

 

 

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I make no bones about it. I was born to be a golfer. I hope with my last breath in this world that I fall over and croak with a golf club in my hand and simultaneously chant that one last Hare Krishna. I take it the Lord will be true to his promise that anyone who remembers the Lord's name when they die gets relief from the miserable conditions of birth and death. If you have to fulfill a quota for how many times the Lord's name has been chanted then what exactly is the total number?

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AM, please ask Lord Krishna to give you the same passion for Him and the taste of His name as you have for golf. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

Keep talking to Him. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

And while we're giving Gita quotes, here's one:

 

"Sarva dharmaan parityajya maamekam saranam vraja; Aham tvaa sarvapaapebhyo mokshayishyaami maa suchah" (BG ch. XVIII - 66)

 

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Dear Vanamalli prabhu,

 

Our Srila Prabhupada stressed it is about, following

the previous acaryas example, yad yad acarati sresthas, tat tad evetaro janah, sa yat pramanam kurute, lokas tad anuvartate "whatever action is performed by a great man,commen men follow in his footsteps. And whatever standards he sets by exemplary acts,all the world pursues.

 

Srila Prabhupada gives credit where credit is due,his eternal spiritual master Srila Bhaktisiddhanta goswami. "our Business is to present the will of Krsna,not that of mundane speculator like the politician,philosopher,or scientist,for they have very little knowledge of Krsna despite all their other knowledge."

 

"This absolute position of Krsna is difficult to understand for any person who is not a devotee of Krsna in the parampara(disciplic succession).-such unauthorized commentary upon Bhagavad-Gita is known as Mayavadi-bhasya, and Lord Caitanya clearly says that anyone who tries to understand Bhagavad-Gita from Mayavadi point of veiw will commit a great blunder."(Bhagavad-Gita preface)

 

I agree that a person must start somewhere but to remain there at the beginning goes nowhere,there is stagnation rather than the experience of unlimited and joyfull progression of ones spiritual life.

 

If...the ancient mariner goes on to, as he says become great in golf then he will give credit where it is due, then every golfer in the world who hears him chanting loudly will follow his example.But I don't think it is a vaisnava pastime to beat little balls around 18 holes, or will he remain happy standing at the first tee banging away...

 

Please forgive me if I have offended you ,but as I am dealing with serious health issues(liver cancer, Hep C

and heart condition) I accept my sufferings due to offensive and ignorant nature,and realize that the discussion of chanting Their Lordships holy names and service in Krsna consciousness to the Guru to be a very serious topic therefore no quarter for nonsense.

 

I hope this meets you well in health and perspicacious in you Krsna conscious endeavors.

 

at the feet of vaisnavas

 

gopijana das

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If...the ancient mariner goes on to, as he says become great in golf then he will give credit where it is due, then every golfer in the world who hears him chanting loudly will follow his example.But I don't think it is a vaisnava pastime to beat little balls around 18 holes, or will he remain happy standing at the first tee banging away...

 

----------------

 

I would not call myself a true Vaishnava or bhakta. I sometimes think that I am, and then I read the description of the devotee in Bhagavad Gita Ch. 12 and realize I am a nothing.

 

The advice I gave was to start from where you are and work your way up.

 

There is nothing wrong in playing golf. You can use any activity in life as puja. If you find yourself getting angry or upset when you lose at golf, that is a sign to you that you need to focus on giving up the fruits of action to Krishna. Certainly renunciation of the karma phalas can be practiced anywhere.

 

The whole point of bhakti yoga is not only to renounce the world, but to join yourself to Krishna. I think it is OK to start from where you are. Right now he is a golfer. He is passionate about golf. So *use* that energy and *divert* it towards Krishna as much as possible.

 

You have not offended me.

 

Wish I could write more, but I have to go now. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif God bless!

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I think an argument could be made that a famous golfer like Tiger Woods would have more power to spread the word of God than a preacher from a religous institution given the reputation of the preachers in the religous institutions within America. For example, the other night Curt Schilling pitched a baseball game in front of millions of drunken goons at the ballpark and at home in front of their TV's sippin a Budweiser. When the game was over Curt Schilling gave all the glory of his success to the Lord Jesus Christ. He had the power to reach all of these hedonists and drunkards by that one statement. How many of them will be inspired by him? Who Knows? Every night Jesse Jackson is on the TV in the guise of a great Christian preacher and all he does is endorse a political candidate. Who is the better preacher?

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If you have to fulfill a quota for how many times the Lord's name has been chanted then what exactly is the total number?

 

 

Its for the mind. I found this in a book:

 

Enter into the four states mentioned in the trinad api sahisnuna verse: (Humility, tolerance, pridelessness, respecting all). Visualize and conceptualize your tiny infinitesimal nature through Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu's graphic examples (straw, tree).

-

 

I think you have problem that somebody will say to you to give up Golf sit is a cave and chant all day. I think your less attracted to golf and more inclined to come into Maya to think you like Golf. Maya will catch anything grab hold of it. I think when we have a weakness Maya catches you. Thats especially true if your not chanting. But one thing is good that even if you don't chant and you like to associate with devotees {like I do}, you kinda want to chant. If you want plane hard truth there it is. Sorry Bhaiji.

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In answer to you query regarding gold in stools, you equate this analogy with finding Krsna consciousness in any filthy place...

 

No one is accussing you of being a filthy or dirty person and yes Krsna is found in every living being regardless what body one inhabits.You need more faith in your self rather than denegrating your self and considering that you are unworthy of the mercy of His Grace Srila Prabhupada,simply because you do not meet the prerequisite number of japa.

 

Don't give up so easily on your self. The spiritual master comes to assist the living entities, and their Lordships appeared as Caitanya Mahaprabhu to pick up the souls of this age of quarrel and hypocricy.

 

but...are you stiving to be the best golfer or the best spiritualist you can and have the potential to be...?

 

BG.6.8.jnana-vijana-trptatma, kuto-stho vijitendriyah, yukta ity ucyate yogi, sama-lostrasma-kancanah

"a person is said to be established in self realization and is called a yogi(or mystic) when he is fully satisfied by virtue of acquired knowledge and realization in transcendance and is self-controlled. He sees everything-whether it be pebbles,stone,or gold-as the same.

 

And Im sorry to say but the proclivities that eminate from eminem are just so much nonsense garbage revealing uncontrolled senses and persona. If he chanted the glories of Their Lordships what he says would be worth hearing. But unfortunately there is no-one helping the poor bugger out of his conditional miseries at present."You gotta want it bad"

 

Bg. cetasa sarva-karmani, mayi sannyasya mat-parah, buddhi-yogam upasritya, mac-cittah satatam bhava

In all activities just depend upon Me and work always under My protection. In such devotional service,be fully conscious of Me.

 

I hope this finds you happy and well in health,

 

yours in service

 

gopijana das

 

 

 

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Yo...yo... hey bro the time has come to get serious

 

all kidding aside don't waste your time im frivolous banter ..life is grand and serious at the same moment in spiritual life.

 

your well wisher

 

gopijana das....

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I am glad someone has a sense of humor, bg.7.25 "I am never manifest to the foolish and uninteligent. for them I am covered by My internal potency, and therefore they do not know that I am unborn and infallible.

 

the purport speaks of proclivities similar to what the poor eminem spouts and mariner quotes...

 

bg.7.15 ....to digress..... na mam dvskrtino mudhah

"those miscreants who are grossly foolish..

do not surrender unto me.

 

"here is qualification.What is that ? tac chraddha munayah

"one must first be faithful. Faithful,sraddadhanah, he must be very eager to see God,actually. Not that as a proclivity,frivolous thing,"can you show me God"A magic, just like God is a magic.No.He must be very serious.

 

Proclivity; 2 references, Proclivities; 11 references

 

A funny thing ....to help poor buggers...To find Guru

it is in Bhagavad-Gita already.....

 

Bg. 1.1 in purport "one should read Bhagavad-Gita very scrutinizingly with the "help"of a person who is a devotee of Sri Krsna and try to understand it without personally motivated interpretation.

 

Bg.2.8 "arjuna put forward so many arguments;" "it appears he was unable to solve his real problem without the "help" of the spiritual master,Lord Sri Krsna.

 

there are a few hundred qoutes regarding topic..

to close ....Bg.7.14. in the purport..."because the bound cannot "help" the bound, the rescuer must be liberated.Therefore,only Lord Krsna or His bona fide representative,the spiritual master can release the conditioned soul.Without such superior "help", one cannot be freed from the bondage of material nature."

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We start from where we are. Following the Bhagavad-gita Sri Krsna manages our road to perfection. At some point He may replace golf with a higher pastime; maybe not. He can use just about anything in His purpose; every stage, in every town and village and subculture. But we start from where we are. It is perfectly natural.

 

For thy God is no ogre.

 

 

 

 

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I agree with you.

 

You know, if we all pray for Ancient Mariner, I'm sure that will help. /images/graemlins/blush.gif)

 

We should be doing something other than just giving advice /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

How about this, I'm going to chant a round now and say you did it /images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

hehe! /images/graemlins/smile.gif Jaya Sri Krishna!

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vana-222 references, vanam-205 references, malli-2 references-antya-lila 1.60 -mallika flowers...garland of mallika flowers of the land mathura..."the mallika flowers are expanding their fragrance"

 

concerning your feelings of stature within Krsna consciousness.. you are fortunate ...Queen Kunti prays

 

Sb.tatha paramahansanam, muninam amalatmanam, bhakti-yoga-vidhanartham, katham pasyam hi striyah

"You yourself descend to propogate the transcendental science of devotiolnal service unto the hearts of the advanced trancendentalists and mental speculators, who are purified by being able to discriminate between matter and spirit. How,then, can we as women know you perfectly ?

 

"He is knowable only by one who has His mercy.this very fact is corroberated by the Queen, who is playing the part of an innocent woman. Women in general are unable to speculate like philosophers, but they are BLESSED by the LORD, because they believe at once the superiority and almitiness of the Lord, and thus they offer obeisances without resevation."

"The Lord is so kind that he does not show special favor only to one who is a great philosopher. He knows the sincerety of purpose. For this reason WOMEN generally ASSEMBLE IN GREAT NUMBERS in any sort of religious function."

"In every country and every religion it appears that the WOMEN ARE MORE INTERESTED, than the men. This simplicity of acceptance of the Lords authority is more effective than showy insincere religious fervor."

 

So for you to come thus far, acceptance spiritual values,initiation, spiritual name ect. is POSITIVE result of Sincerety and seriousness...

 

----the precession of ones mentality lends to the evidential outcome of ones paucity of conscience / or Krsna consciousness-----

 

Chant for yourself, and the benefit of others.This is Vaisnava....you go girl....

 

Me, i'd rather be golfing with you know who...Hare krsna

 

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"wow ....don't give in just yet, what you feel chanting Hare Krsna is very real, its like the differance between sprinting or running a marathon, you're in training for the longest mile at the end of life...."" some times we get out of breath, then get a second wind"

 

gopijana...

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In all seriousness you seem like a genuine devotee so I apologize if I offended you in any way. I keep trying to chant but after 10 or 15 minutes I feel like I am faking it. For that first 10 to 15 minutes it feels real. Thanks for your good advice.

 

 

We are faking it if we think we are not. This applies to most of us and the exceptions are there but rare.

 

Myself I have never chanted with the intent to please Krsna. Not one name. Usually I chant because I know it will be to my benefit either now or later. If it makes me feel immediately good and peaceful or happy I keep it going. If no immediate reward is apparent then I can't keep going very long.

 

Real chanting of Krsna nama means to chant with love for Him.

 

So most of us are imitating along, practicing as we are able. But we don't become fakers until we start pretending we have some real taste when we don't. Feigning bliss or ectasy or some sort for cheap adoration.

 

You may be a practioner but I doubt that you are a faker.

 

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