Hindus Against God ??

[gHari]

I can't believe this nonsense:

 

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1042502.cms

 

<blockquote> WASHINGTON: With the Hindu American Foundation (HAF) being part of an amicus curiae (friend of the court), oral arguments have begun in the Supreme Court on whether displays of the Ten Commandments on government property are an unconstitutional endorsement of a particular religion.

 

At heart of the case is a six-foot tall granite monument with the Ten Commandments inscribed on it and which stands between the State Capitol and State Supreme Court in Texas.

 

"We are not opposing any specific teachings or religious faith. This is about separation of state and church," Suhag Shukla, HAF's legal counsel, said after the first day of arguments last week.

 

Being an amicus curiae Shukla is not scheduled to make any arguments herself but is involved in so much as it lends support to the petition challenging the location of the Texas monument.

 

"The brief makes it clear that the co-signatories regard the Ten Commandments with utmost respect, but the overtly religious monument is a blow to pluralism, and its prominent presence on Texas Capitol grounds implies political and social exclusion of Hindus, Jains and Buddhists alike.

 

"The district and appellate courts failed to consider the effect of the monument on those adhering to non-Judeo-Christian faiths," Shukla said.

 

HAF, which filed the brief Dec 13, 2004 in one of the most widely anticipated cases being heard by the Supreme Court this year, "supports the position that the monument violates the separation of church and state guaranteed by the First Amendment of the US constitution".

 

There are nine co-signatories to the brief representing Hindus, Buddhists and Jains in the United States.

 

The foundation claims to be the first to provide a non-Judeo-Christian perspective to this issue.

 

The case originally brought by Thomas Van Orden against Rick Perry, the governor of Texas in 2003, asks for the removal of a Ten Commandments monument from Texas State Capitol grounds.

 

The Supreme Court decided to hear the case after the Fifth Circuit Federal Court of Appeals ruled that the monument could remain in place.

 

The 34-page brief was signed by HAF, Arsha Vidya Pitham, Arya Samaj of Michigan, Hindu International Council Against Defamation, Hindu University of America, Navya Shastra, Saiva Siddhanta Church, Federation of Jain Associations in North America, Interfaith Freedom Foundation and prominent Buddhist scholar and director of Tibet House, Robert Thurman.

 

Asked if the issue HAF was raising was not too esoteric, Shukla said, "It is about principle. As long as the US constitution is the way it is now, it does not endorse any particular religion.

 

"The presence of the statue on government property amounts to endorsement."

 

"The supreme court's decision in the Van Orden case will directly impact Hindus and others," Nikhil Joshi, a member of the HAF board of directors was quoted as saying by its official backgrounder. "A permanent display of the Ten Commandments on the State Capitol grounds implies an unconstitutional preference for those precepts etched on the monument."

 

The brief argues that the Ten Commandments are a corner stone of Judeo-Christian theology. </blockquote>

[gHari]

 

Now we will remove the Bible from the courtroom and God from the dollar bill. We seem allied with the atheists once again. I am ashamed.

 

[Guest guest]

this is typical of todays Hindus. Just chant and be happy.

[theist]

A hindu version of the People for the American Way, lead by that ass Barry Lynn. Wants to eliminate any mention of God from every public platform. Also considers himself a Christian preacher.

[Guest guest]

Like every religion that doesn't understand it's real identity they are just going to have to wake up.

Or they will add one more side to the unholy triad of false Islam, false Christianity and false Judaism whose horns are all interlocked with each other in a triangle of misconception. All killing the other party to prove they are the supreme team.

 

Any hindus care to make a square dance?

 

No thanks, no ruchi!

 

Sarva-dharman parityajya, mam ekam saranam vraja

 

Give it all up, and let us join Nataraj in the great dance.

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna,

 

 

Now we will remove the Bible from the courtroom and God from the dollar bill. We seem allied with the atheists once again. I am ashamed.

 

 

What has bible to do with Bhagavan. Nothing. Bible is a human creation full of fallacies. So standing against falsehood is in no way standing against Bhagavan. Since you are a westerner you post ridiculous nonsense.

[gHari]

 

Because you are an easterner you post ridiculous nonsense. Without the Bible the west would be hell. Don't hold opinions about things you know nothing about. I doubt that such a person knows anything of the Vedas either - beyond the external words. We have too many experts who talk about things they do not understand - including the HAF.

 

It's not us versus them - it's us versus us.

 

[Guest guest]

as though you think you have understood Vedas ?

 

and how do you know that without bible west would be hell ?

 

Infact all hell in this world(all the wars from crusade to jihad) etc. are perpetrated by belief in and because of bible and quran. The fact is that great suffering exists in this world today because of bible and quran. The same cannot betold about Vedas. Hindus do not go on war to establish superiority over other religions. It is the ignorant bible followers and quran followers who engage in this nonsense.

 

and anybody who thinks that bible is creating peace in west is insane and posting nonsense. As I saids before only a westerner is capable of posting such non-sense.

 

Does the words crusade and jihad ring a bell ? Are you crazy or what ?

[gHari]

 

And Jesus. You are simply an arrogant fool.

 

[Guest guest]

Guest: "What has bible to do with Bhagavan. Nothing. Bible is a human creation full of fallacies. So standing against falsehood is in no way standing against Bhagavan. Since you are a westerner you post ridiculous nonsense."

 

In reply,

 

Srila Prabhupada: "There are mahajanas among the Christian saints. They include Christ, and in addition to Christ, so many others—St. Matthew, St. Thomas, and so forth. These mahajanas are mentioned in the Bible. A mahajana is one who strictly follows the original religion and knows things as they are. And that means he must be coming in the parampara, the system of disciplic succession." - from Civilization and Transcendence, Chap. 12: How to Love God

 

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare

Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare

[Guest guest]

 

Re: Yes, I Understand the Veda And Jesus. You are simply an arrogant fool.

 

 

There is no arrogance beyond this, one who says shamelessly that he has understood Vedas when in reality you are in bondage as anybody else(including me).

 

As for bible and other scriptures, Manu Samhita clearly states that anything that is outside of Shastras have origin in darkness. They are created and destroyed. So bible, quran all come spring out of ignorance. They are not worth following.

 

You did not answer my question ? Why did crusade and jihad arise ? Do you think they arose out of vacuum. It is very clear that bible and quran teach exclusivity and encourage the followers to convert others. Do you want me to quote words of constantinople from 4th century AD. The very start of christianity is full of bloody violence. So is of Islam. Instead of getting carried away by anger and blinded by EGO, please do a careful study of both church history and hadiths.

 

and think deeply whether you really understand Vedas. If you really do, then you must know Lord Krishna as the great Vaishnavas like Ramanuja, Madhva, Bhaktivinoda Thakura etc. Only they can claim to know Vedas. Do you think you have that caliber. Why do you lie to yourself and others ?

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna,

 

 

Guest: "What has bible to do with Bhagavan. Nothing. Bible is a human creation full of fallacies. So standing against falsehood is in no way standing against Bhagavan. Since you are a westerner you post ridiculous nonsense."

 

In reply,

 

Srila Prabhupada: "There are mahajanas among the Christian saints. They include Christ, and in addition to Christ, so many others—St. Matthew, St. Thomas, and so forth. These mahajanas are mentioned in the Bible. A mahajana is one who strictly follows the original religion and knows things as they are. And that means he must be coming in the parampara, the system of disciplic succession." - from Civilization and Transcendence, Chap. 12: How to Love God

 

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare

Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare

 

 

I find this totally against Vedas.

 

First thing, when a Guru says something wrong(or atleast you find it against what Shastras preach), you need not accept it. Unless you give a good explanation for this.

 

With all respect, Srila Prabhupada, is one of my Gurus. I have no problem accepting jesus as a great Human being. Nothing more. Others, his disciples, had the terrible misconception that Jesus is god himself. This is very clear from bible, the new testament which again differes from what jesus himself taught. So calling these people as Mahajan is not right. One who knows Krishna(as a consequence of knowing Vedas), only he can be called a Mahajan. I do not know how this is applicable to say Paul and others.

[Guest guest]

Stop this nonsense.

 

The ten commandments are not a key to spiritual life, they are a key that separates humans from animals. To follow the ten means that one is human, not a Guru.

 

And Srila Prabhupada did not mention Paul as a mahajana, he did mention Thomas, Matthew, and James as well, who did purely follow jesus, and did NOT create an artificial eccliastic religion, and did not say Jesus was the Father.

 

In fact, when Thomas placed his finger in the wound of Lord Jesus, he recognized the "relationship" between his brother, Jesus, and the Father who sent Him. He said "My Lord and my God", which is not different from a vaisnava saying, "Sri Guru and Sri Gauranga". He saw the "connection" between Jesus and the One who snet Him, who Jesus referred to as Abbha, Elahoy, Jahovia, and other Names as well.

 

Im not a fan of public display of the ten commandments. I find is offensive, especially in front of government buildings where all ten commandments are broken without remorse every minute. The politicians who support this display are demons who make vaisnava aparadha by citing this display as something that must be preserved.

 

If these fools would follow just one of these commandments, it would accomplish much more that all the fools who want such a hypocritical display of something no one believes in.

 

I mean, how do we FOLLOW the acarya who presented these laws. He Broke them to pieces rather than display them to unfaithful eyes. Consider that, or prove me wrong. Moses would not display them, why should we criticize ACLU or non-christians who dont want them displayed.

 

hare krsna, mahaksadasa

 

TBC

[rand0M aXiS]

The Big Ten

They’re a good thing.

 

Much has been written about the Supreme Court case of Van Orden v. Perry, which has at its center a monument of the Ten Commandments that has stood between the Texas State Capitol and the Texas Supreme Court in Austin since 1961. Thomas Van Orden wants to remove it. The state of Texas wants to keep it right where it is.

 

The Ten Commandments should stay right where they are — in all cases. Various monuments, structures, and statues of the Ten Commandments can be found all over the U.S., including some highly visible spots in Washington, D.C. Courtesy of “God in the Temples of Government,” a photo essay by Carrie Devorah in Human Events (the crusading national conservative weekly), we are reminded of three prominent monuments in the capital city: Moses and the Ten Commandments can be found in the rotunda of the Library of Congress, on the rear façade of the U.S. Supreme Court, and inside the Supreme Court’s courtroom.

 

The Ten Commandments are literally chiseled into the American way of life. But there is a campaign going on that would rid this country of any and all religious references. This is part of the ongoing culture war that would stop religious expression in politics and the public square, even though we remain the most religious of all the major industrial countries. Fortunately, brave people like state attorney general Greg Abbott, who recently argued the Texas position in Van Orden v. Perry before the Supremes, want to keep it that way.

 

Religion has always been central to our national identity. Religious references do not violate the First Amendment, which was never intended to bar all religious expression or discussion from national discourse. James Madison himself, the author of the First Amendment, was sworn in with his left hand on the Bible. So was George Washington, and, I believe, every president since.

 

The Ten Commandments provide the very foundation of our nation’s legal code. They also make up the basis of the moral values that thankfully guide us in our everyday lives.

 

I have a suspicion, however, that too many folks forget what’s on that list of commandments, or maybe never learned them in the first place. And even if we do know the Ten Commandments by heart, it never hurts to read them through and contemplate them from time to time. So here’s all ten:

 

 

 

I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt not have strange gods before me.

 

Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.

 

Remember that thou keep holy the Sabbath day.

 

Honor thy mother and father.

 

Thou shalt not kill.

 

Thou shalt not commit adultery.

 

Thou shalt not steal.

 

Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

 

Thou shalt not covet they neighbor’s wife.

 

Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.

 

 

I have a few direct questions for you: Is it such a bad thing to think about not killing, not stealing, not lying, and not committing adultery? Is it so bad to talk about honoring one’s parents? Or to think about a power greater than oneself — about God or some higher deity? Or to set aside just one day a week as a spiritual day, separate from the material strivings of the other six days?

 

Attempting to live by these moral and religious values is a worthy endeavor. No one of us is perfect; that role is for God alone. But if we strive for better values in our day-to-day lives, if we seek to meet the age-old standards of goodness and honesty, if we try to help our neighbors in all we do, won’t we be better people, even if our imperfections cause us to fall short?

 

I should think that anyone who strolls the grounds of the Texas state capitol, and for one moment stops to read the Ten Commandments on the monument that Mr. Abbott is trying to keep in place, will be the better for it. Moral commandments — like most spiritual thoughts in this day and age — seem too few and far removed from our usual toils and tribulations. But deep down inside we all have a desire to live as better citizens, better spouses, better parents, better co-workers, and better friends. An occasional reminder as to how to do this cannot be a bad thing. No — keeping the Ten Commandments in the public square must perforce be a good thing.

 

 

[Guest guest]

1)I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt not have strange gods before me.

 

strange gods: Oil, money, america, the presidency, democracy, capitalism (communism, fascism, etc.)

 

2)Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.

 

Vanity: See the teachings of King Solomom. religiosity, exclusionism, sectarianism

 

3)Remember that thou keep holy the Sabbath day.

 

super bowl, golf? Monday thru Saturday?

 

4)Honor thy mother and father.

 

which ones? Are cows included?

 

5)Thou shalt not kill.

 

see the teachings of Srila Prabhupada

 

6)Thou shalt not commit adultery.

 

Practically speaking, this should read "Thou shalt not commit adultery on the Sabbath". Even then, how about some non hypocracy?

 

7)Thou shalt not steal.

 

Victims are 90% of the worlds population

 

8)Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

 

Give me a break.

 

9)Thou shalt not covet they neighbor’s wife.

 

10)Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.

 

Forget it!

 

Rupa Goswami would do a rewrite. "Thou shalt always remember and never forget the Supreme Lord." This is a plaque I would support, not the above sample of utter hypocracy.

 

Lord Jesus did a rewrite as well, which I would support. "Love the Supreme Lord with thy whole mind, body, and heart, and love all beings to the extent that one loves himself."

 

Again, I ask: If Moses had to destroy the tablets to prevent the utterly unfaithful from seeing them, why should we flaunt them in disregard for his decision.

 

If the ark of the covenant has been hidden with curses etc, why should we support fanatic hypocrites in their desire to cast pearls before swine?

 

Get rid of them, unless posted on private property. Render to caesar what is caesar, post the US constitution on public buildings, I would support, even though the hypocracy mentioned above is similar with these fanatics in regard to the constitution. Priests should preach the ten commandments, even in public, this is samkirtana. But taxpayers should not have to support religious doctrine that is never adhered to, taxpayers have to support enough hypocracy in the name of nationalism and other isms, why place a foreign religiosity on them, thus breaking the Bill of Rights.

 

Its not freedom of religion, it is freedom FROM religion. To not practice is just as protected as the right to worship, this is the issue here.

 

Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa