Srila Prabhupada's Nitya-lila Svarupa

[rsbj]

OM Sreem!!!

 

Dandavats!!! Regardless of what anyone thinks of me, rightly or wrongly, I had conversations in Bengali with Srila Prabhupada during 1973 in Mayapur. I never directly asked him for his svarupa information, but once I asked HDG if manjari-bhava was the "goal" of our Sampradaya, Srila Prabhupada said, "Yes, down to Shakya!" That made be believe that Srila Prabhupada's nitya svarupa is in Shakya rati shambandanuga raganuga bhakti, following the wake of Lord Krishna's friends who are shambandharup-ragatmika Shakya Rati personified.

 

This is just based on what HDG said, and how he acted. I also heard that Akinchan Krishnadas Babaji was in Shakya raganuga. Once I asked him and he replied with a laughing, "Hare Krishna!!"

 

But I am not sure how that relates to Pujya Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, whose Manjari bhava is no secret.

 

I'm not sure how they relate - apart from that catch all excuse of "achintya".

 

Any comments are encouraged, because I certainly don't know. If Srila Prabhupada is in Shakya Rati, then I better head that way too.

 

Hare Krishna!!!

HD

[kailasa]

Srila Prabhupada is Srivasa Thakur, He is in sakhya in Krisan lila (Madhumangala) and madhurya vipralambha in Gaura lila. Both - madhurya rasa Krisna lila, sakhya rasa Krisna lila rise in Gaura lila on one more higes level - madhurya vipealambha.

 

It is like Ramananda Ray who is Pandava Arjuna.

 

Then Srila Prabhupada vrite - "sambhoga (direct relations Krisna lila) for neopfits"

 

 

[Guest guest]

Well, it's hard for me to combat what you are saying.

 

However, I have read a lecture by Narayana Maharaja. He says in this lecture that the disciple is striving to be like the guru, regarding his svarupa. Why be a disciple of a manjari if you are a sakha? It doesn't really make the most logical sense. If your goal is to be a manjari, palya dasi of Srimati Radhika, then you and your guru will be manjari. Otherwise, you should be disciple of someone else. Our goal is Raganuga Gaudiya Vaisnavism is to be palya dasi of srimati radhika. End of story.

[kailasa]

He is start Gaura lila in Navadvipa. He is start movement KC for all world. He is expansion Lord Caitanya.

 

"Yes, everybody says like that, that I am incarnation of Caitanya Mahaprabhu."

[rsbj]

Dandavat, Prabhu!!! That is very clear information. Like SP "IS" Srivas Thakur, and also busy with so many other rasas and lilas at the same instance. How have you reached these conclusions?

 

Coincidently, how can we meditate on HDG's "nitya svarupa" without confidential information? Otherwise it would be abstract or mundane (like HDG was an old man).

 

I guess HDG indicated to me that this information can be transmitted to us by HDG at the instant of self-realization, even after his physical disappearence.

 

This would be either a bona fide revelation resulting from "Pusti" OR it would be a mental concoction.

 

Question is, what is the pratical path of Srila Prabhupada smaran besides what we see externally?

 

These are just thoughts...

 

Hare Krishna!!!

HD

[kailasa]

Pure devotee teach all rasas. Read this in folio. Sriman Narayana do not understand mood gaudiya vaisnavas and Gosvamis Vrinadavan. He is teach only sambhoga Krisna lila it is level for neophits. Sriman Narayana preach sahajiya.

 

"Not sambhoga. Vipralambha. Vipralambha-seva"

 

"The Gosvamis also taught us like that. He r?dhe vraja-dev?ke ca lalite he nanda-s?no kuta?. They in the V?nd?vana remained authorized persons. They were also searching after Krsna. They never said that "We have got Krsna," never said."

 

I am do not able write big writing.

[kailasa]

Thanks Prabhu! All glory Srila Prabhupada!

 

It is revelation in 2000 year ... /images/graemlins/smile.gif Lord Brahma (i am do not see His), great emotions /images/graemlins/smile.gif, me head roll /images/graemlins/smile.gif) then i am read books Prabhupada, now me spiritual master speak - Prabhupada is Srivas. Srila Prabhupada is head all devotees Lord Caitanya, He is general Lord Caitanya, He is founder-acarya all sampradaya.

 

"Krisna Balaram" is sakhiya it is obvious.

[kailasa]

It is me page on site russian ISKCON

 

http://krishna.ru/forum/viewforum.php?f=50

 

learn russian language /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

I am supreme moderator in this page /images/graemlins/smile.gif /images/graemlins/smile.gif /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[rsbj]

What is written is well said. I don't know about Narayana Maharj except we were friends back 1968-1973 when he young. Now I suppose Manjari bhava. It is fact that Prabhupada Sarasvati Thakura was in Manjari Bhava, eternally, Prabhupada told me that his Guru came down from Krishna nitya lila to teach.

 

If Bhakti Siddhanta Thakur is Manjari Bhava, which we know is Rupanuga and bona fide... and yet Srila Prabhupada indicated his rasa was "Down to Shakya". Can a manjari Rupanugi have a shakya disciple?

 

It all used to seem very simple to comprehend in earily Vrindavan GM. But now it is sounding more complicated than material life.

 

OM Sreem!!!

 

Hare Krishna!!!

HD

[kailasa]

SBT SBST both from gaura lila, they both come from Jagannatha Puri. SP "Krisna" means Lord Caitanya.

 

SBST manjari, but in Gaura lila all devotees Lord Caitanya rise more highe level. SBST leave His body in vipralambha mood, it is obvious. Svarupa Krisna lila SBST do not so important, His devotion for Lord Caitanya more important.

 

Head all sampradaya Srila Madhavendra Puri is kalpa vriksa, santa rasa. Svarupa as manjaris it is not nain thing in OUR sampradaya. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

Guru give for you liberation. In krisna lila not worsipping, not sadhana. In Krisna lila nobody do not worship Krisna as God. You be liberated and YOURS NATURAL EMOTIONS come /images/graemlins/smile.gif Guru do not theach you as kises Krisna /images/graemlins/smile.gif /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

Sahajiyas make buisnes for "distributing swarupa". Most of them do not has any swarupa himself. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

In general way, lessions SP do not needs raganuga-sadhana. If person rise in madhurya vipralambha, then yours svarupa Krisna lila come NATURAL WAY. Then SBST finis all artifikal methods, no needs any artifical methods.

 

Guru help open you svarupa, yes, any liberated guru may help, this do not needs equal rasa - madhurya-madhurya. SR write - "pure devotee theach all rasas".

[kailasa]

Rupa Gosvami Stava mala, mala 3

 

TEXT 240

 

"Separation from Krsna is better than meeting Him. When I meet Him there is only one Krsna, but when I am separated from Him the three worlds become filled with Krsnas."

 

It is real rupanuga

 

Jaiva Dharma

 

"Goswami: Material love is part of the material world. Lord for Krsna is beyond the material world, and it is also the origin of many wonderful things. Material love is pleasant when the beloved and present and unpleasant when the beloved is absent. When a person loves Krsna and Krsna is present, then the lover experiences the taste of a certain kind of rasa, the rasa of sambhoga-sukha (the happiness of enjoying with Krsna). However, when Krsna is absent, the lover experiences the rasa of vipralambha (separation), which itself produces a specific kind of wonderful transcendental bliss. In answer to one of Lord Mahaprabhu's questions, Ramananda Raya described (Sri Caitanya-caritamrta Madhya 8.194) the wonderful bliss the devotee feel in separation from Krsna, a bliss he called 'vivarta'. Therefore what seems here to be suffering is IN TRUTH the highest spiritual bliss."

 

Yes, SP write - SBST come from Lord Caitanya, i am read this in folio.

[kailasa]

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu wanted to POINT OUT this intense love of Krsna exhibited by Madhavendra Puri. All Caitanya Mahaprabhus devotees later followed in the footsteps of Madhavendra Puri, serving the Lord without personal considerations.

Madhya 4.179

---------------------------

 

Worship in separation is considered by the Gaudiya-Madhva-sampradaya to be the TOPMOST level of devotional service. According to this conception, the devotee thinks of himself as very poor and neglected by the Lord.

 

Such an ecstatic feeling is the HIGHEST form of devotional service. Because Krsna had gone to Mathura, Srimati Radharani was very much affected, and She expressed Herself thus: “My dear Lord, because of Your separation My mind has become overly agitated. Now tell Me, what can I do? I am very poor and You are very merciful, so kindly have compassion upon Me and let Me know when I shall see You.” Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu was ALWAYS expressing the ecstatic emotions of Srimati Radharani that She exhibited when She saw Uddhava at Vrndavana. Similar feelings, experienced by Madhavendra Puri, are expressed in this verse. Therefore, Vaisnavas in the Gaudiya-Madhva-sampradaya say that the ecstatic feelings experienced by Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu during His appearance came from Sri Madhavendra Puri through Isvara Puri. All the devotees in the line of the Gaudiya-Madhva-sampradaya accept these principles of devotional service.

 

--------------------------

 

I offer my respectful obeisances unto Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, who is compared to a cloud that pours water on fields of grain, which are like devotees suffering due to a shortage of rain. Separation from Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu is like a drought, but when the Lord returns, His presence is like a nectarean rain that falls on all the grains and saves them from perishing.

Madhya 10.2

[kailasa]

There are two kinds of transcendental feelings for those engaged in the worship of the Lord. One is called sambhoga, and the other is called viraha. According to authorities in the disciplic line, viraha worship is more palatable than sambhoga worship. Sambhoga takes place in direct touch, whereas viraha takes place without such direct contact. Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu taught us to accept viraha worship. In the present state of affairs we cannot make any direct touch with the Personality of Godhead. But if we practice the viraha mode of worship we can transcendentally realize the presence of the Lord MORE lovingly than in His presence.

 

Without love of Godhead there is no meaning even to direct contact. During the presence of the Lord there were thousands and thousands of men, but because they were not in love of Godhead they could hardly realize the Personality of Godhead, Sri Krsna. Therefore we must first activate our dormant love of Godhead by following the prescribed rules and by following in the footsteps of the authorities who are actually fixed in love of Godhead. The gopis provide the highest example of such unalloyed love of Godhead, and Lord Caitanya at the ---ULTIMATE--- stage of realization displayed the viraha worship in the mood of the gopis.

 

In the mundane world there is also some shadow of such viraha. A loving wife, husband, or friend may for some time be maddened by the absence of the beloved. Such a state of mind, however, is not permanent. The loving husband or wife takes to another and forgets everything of the past. This is so because there is no reality to such relationships in the material world.

 

The spiritual situation, however, is completely different. A bona fide lover of God could never forget Him, even in exchange for everything else. The devotee of the Lord cannot be happy in any circumstance without the Lord. In the absence of the Lord the devotee associates with Him by remembering His separation, and because the Lord is absolute, the devotees feeling of separation is transcendentally ---MORE RELISABLE--- than direct contact. This is possible only when we develop GENUE LOVE for Him.