Probes into Space

[Pankaja_Dasa]

 

 

Did anybody ever wonder how it's possible to send these into space? I wonder how Scientist's did it. Do you think they really did.? To pin-point the exact movements of Mars, and send a probe?

 

Reading bit of Canto 5 of Bhagavatam, I'm really surprized. I'm sure all thier calculations [scientist] are wrong. But the thing is, the Goverment is always trying to cheat us, though I wonder how far the cheating can go, I mean like me for example, If i was a Scientist working in a Lab etc, and some other person from N.A.S.A came along told me somebody landed on the moon, would I believe them? I probably would. ANd why is that? I'll be back.

[Gaea]

i'm afraid 1 + 1 always = 2 !!!

 

when (literally) thousands of independant scientists and academic bodies agree on calculations and confirm astro-events, including man-made ones like probes, it's difficult to believe that they're all part of some big conspiracy. In fact, it's pretty much impossible to keep a secret like that, don't you think?

 

The fact is that your phone, the internet you're on, your tv etc. just wouldn't work if there wasn't a satellite in orbit - the physics and maths adds up perfectly. There is too much hard evidence to prove that it all really is out there.

 

I've met devotees that have trouble with this also - how can the SB be so "wrong"? We can talk about symbology or matter-of-factness until the cows come home, but one has to be willing to accept the evidence "As it is", just as you would the Gita "As it is".

[Pankaja_Dasa]

when (literally) thousands of independant scientists and academic bodies agree on calculations and confirm astro-events, including man-made ones like probes, it's difficult to believe that they're all part of some big conspiracy. In fact, it's pretty much impossible to keep a secret like that, don't you think?

 

 

 

 

TRANSLATION

Above the rays of the sunshine by a distance of 100,000 yojanas [800,000 miles] is the moon, which travels at a speed faster than that of the sun. In two lunar fortnights the moon travels through the equivalent of a saàvatsara of the sun, in two and a quarter days it passes through a month of the sun, and in one day it passes through a fortnight of the sun.

 

PURPORT

When we take into account that the moon is 100,000 yojanas, or 800,000 miles, above the rays of the sunshine, it is very surprising that the modern excursions to the moon could be possible. Since the moon is so distant, how space vehicles could go there is a doubtful mystery. Modern scientific calculations are subject to one change after another, and therefore they are uncertain. We have to accept the calculations of the Vedic literature. These Vedic calculations are steady; the astronomical calculations made long ago and recorded in the Vedic literature are correct even now. Whether the Vedic calculations or modern ones are better may remain a mystery for others, but as far as we are concerned, we accept the Vedic calculations to be correct.

http://srimadbhagavatam.com/5/22/8/en1

 

 

Yeah that's what I think. But problem is that the probe missions are usually kept top-secret until the actual mission. And the Data is sent out later to the masses. So what goes on between this point and before is a mystery!

 

Who knows eh? Maybe they did goto the Moon or Mars. But does that means then Bhagavatam is wrong? No way, we just need to inquire and chant more /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[Guest guest]

I give the material scientists their due. In one sense I am awed by their ability to use mathematical calculations and very sophisticated engineering prowess to pull off these endeavors. Now that doesn't mean they or the Govt. won't also lie aout their failures. We the common laymen are easy to fool. Like children really.

 

Krsna is the intelligence of the intelligence so any success they have is due to Krishna and is further caused to appreciate Him.

 

It is their foolish waste of time and energy that we object to. Live's misspent in trying to expand the reach of the hopelessly inadequate material senses.

 

We also oppose and challenge them consistently on any atheistic conclusions they come to and their efforts to try to infect the innocent citizens of earth with.

[Kulapavana]

SB 5.22.8

evam candrama arka-gabhastibhya uparishtal laksha-yojanata upalabhyamano 'rkasya samvatsara-bhuktim pakshabhyam masa-bhuktim sapadarkshabhyam dinenaiva paksha-bhuktim agracari drutatara-gamano bhunkte

 

SYNONYMS

 

evam -- thus; candrama -- the moon; arka-gabhastibhyah -- from the rays of the sunshine; uparishtat -- above; laksha-yojanatah -- by a measurement of 100,000 yojanas; upalabhyamanah -- being situated; arkasya -- of the sun globe; samvatsara-bhuktim -- the passage of one year of enjoyment; pakshabhyam -- by two fortnights; masa-bhuktim -- the passage of one month; sapada-rikshabhyam -- by two and a quarter days; dinena -- by a day; eva -- only; paksha-bhuktim -- the passage of a fortnight; agracari -- moving impetuously; druta-tara-gamanah -- passing more speedily; bhunkte -- passes through.

 

 

Read the individual words in the verse and compare to the quoted translation - there are obviously other ways to translate this verse.

 

you have to have detailed knowledge of such things to properly render them in translation. SP wanted his science-minded disciples to study these issues, as - by his own admission - he was not an expert in that area. Practically speaking that knowledge is lost and must be re-discovered.

 

think about this phrase: "Above the rays of the sunshine" what EXACTLY does it mean? rays of sunshine reach all corners of the solar system. what is "one year of enjoyment"? is it a lunar year as perceived on the heavenly planets? there are more questions than answers here.

 

even the yojana as a unit of measure can be anything between 4 and 12 miles. it simply means: a day journey of a heavily laden ox cart.

 

 

[Gaea]

hi.

 

 

I give the material scientists their due. In one sense I am awed by their ability to use mathematical calculations and very sophisticated engineering prowess to pull off these endeavors. Now that doesn't mean they or the Govt. won't also lie aout their failures. We the common laymen are easy to fool. Like children really.

 

 

 

I don't think we should take the angle of "we are small/ignorant/children, how can we know if we're being lied to". We all have a God-given intelligence - we should use it. In the case that some people are refuting man's endevours to the moon, for example, we have to look at facts - everything points to the fact that it was done (ok, the first moon-landing seemed a little dodgy though).

 

Krsna is the intelligence of the intelligence so any success they have is due to Krishna and is further caused to appreciate Him.

 

 

 

Agreed.

 

 

It is their foolish waste of time and energy that we object to. Live's misspent in trying to expand the reach of the hopelessly inadequate material senses.

 

 

Not all objections are based on this, but point taken.

 

 

We also oppose and challenge them consistently on any atheistic conclusions they come to and their efforts to try to infect the innocent citizens of earth with.

 

 

Yes, this is important.

[Pankaja_Dasa]

 

 

think about this phrase: "Above the rays of the sunshine" what EXACTLY does it mean

--

 

Yeah I was wondering what that meant. Thought it was only me. Not sure about expert or not, but maybe SP left it for disicples to do. I remember one video conversation, SP says Bhaktivinoda could have completed His work, but He left credit to us [meaning disicples etc]. And joe bloggs like me hehe

[Guest guest]

This is where I drew that from:

 

 

Prabhupada: Yes. Why shall I give you? You are a rascal, you are against Krishna, why Krishna will give you facility? If you are against Krishna and you want the credit without Krishna, that's not possible. You must be submissive first of all. Then Krishna will give you all facilities. Just like we dare to face any chemist, any scientist, any philosopher. Why? On the strength of Krishna, we believe that "There is Krishna. When I shall talk with him, Krishna will give give me intelligence." This is the basics. Otherwise, from qualification, standard, they are very much qualified. We are common laymen before them. But how do we challenge them? Because we know. Just like a small child He can challenge a very big man because he knows, "My father is there." He is catching the hand of the father, and he's sure that "Nobody can do anything to me."

 

 

 

As a layman I feel like a child before a trained scientist when discussing his field. The same with speaking law with a trained jurist. Or anyone expert in their field for that matter.

 

If I try to weigh their evidence against other available evidence the whole thing becomes impossible. My only hope is to learn to hear Krsna. The Bhagavatam is certainly not very clear on these points.