Bhakta Don Muntean Posted December 31, 2005 Report Share Posted December 31, 2005 ...This age of Kali will certainly be full of all activities of Kali, but this does not mean that the leaders of society, the executive heads, the learned and intelligent men, or above all the devotees of the Lord should sit down tightly and become callous to the reactions of the age of Kali. In the rainy season certainly there will be profuse rainfalls, but that does not mean that men should not take means to protect themselves from the rains.... [sB 1.17.28, purport] ...if you try to educate the mass of people to become educated to elect the right person, that is very difficult. But if a king, a person, is educated nicely, that is easier. That is my point of view.... [Room Conversation July 23, 1973] Please let's try to make this thread follow this direction. BDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2005 Report Share Posted December 31, 2005 First quote says to me that the proper action is called for and that should not be neglected by thoughtful men. It is easy to become callous to the overwhelming onslaught of the present age. We are forced to come to grips with our small natures and accept that our response to the present storm will be also be small and inadequent to the task. But that is no excuse for hardening our hearts in defeat and ignoring the situation. Even though our effects may be small when billions are having their human lifes spoiled if we can reach one or two or even a handful to those souls the effort will seem huge and very significant. Reaching them means of course with the chanting of the Lord's names. The second quote is true of course, a saintly king is better than a democracy but I believe a democracy is better than a cruel dictatorship. But this is kali-yuga and we should not think that a Yudhistira will take power as king or president anytime soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2006 Report Share Posted January 1, 2006 Me likes generic discussion strings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2006 Report Share Posted January 1, 2006 It is becoming more clear every day that there is a problem with religion. One religion in particular feels it must spread itself through force throughout the entire planet. Before the world developed a global conscience, many countries were subdued by this religion, according to the dictates of their scripture (and the interpretation thereof by some). These areas include major portions of Africa, Russia, Indonesia, Bangladesh, Kashmir, in fact one need only look to the spots where terror and strife exist and we seem to find that religious undertone prevalent. The approach seems to have been to infiltrate the area until they hold a majority and then terrorize the rest of the inhabitants until it is declared an Islamic state. The future I see not too far down the road is a complete rejection by the free world of this religious zealousness to the point where the borders will no longer allow potential terrorists to enter. This would include all professing that religion. You may say that is not fair, but after a few more major assaults on the West, the word 'fair' will be tossed out of the vocabulary. We know their kids are taught to hate Americans in the religious schools. How long before these kids grow up and bring their families to your neighborhood. We saw locals in Britain bomb their citizens. It will not take too many of such scenarios before push turns to shove, and they are all escorted back to their place of birth. We need a religious solution, because the political and military solutions are both too unlikely and too drastic. We need to promote a new understanding of their scripture that realizes that the passages condoning murder, rape, slavery, and theft were not meant as guidelines of conduct forever. They were special instructions in special circumstances meant to protect the early church from the threatening agents in the desert. This is the 21st century - there should be no threatening agents. But they must be made aware that the world will no longer tolerate the insanity and murder, nor will it be fooled by the bluff of peace followed by terror. How long before the bluff of peace of the Western immigrations of sweet ladies and kids turns to terror, turns into another Kashmir, another Bangkok? Forty years, eighty years? The pattern is set, and only a naive fool will not see it. The nobility of the West will tumble under another terror attack, and the immigrants will fear for their lives, run for their lives. We are not a civilized people either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2006 Report Share Posted January 1, 2006 From the beginning we must decide if this thread will be best suited for the Spiritual discussions thread or World review. Myself I have finally burned out on the political side of things. The protective class must act to protect those they are sworn to protect. That's all. But because they are also mostly imposters that will only happen if they deem it within their self interest. The so-called protectors of today are taking their counsel (and money) from the merchant class and not from the priestly class. One reason is there is no priestly class to guide them even if they would listen. In short, it's a mess. /images/graemlins/wink.gif Thankfully it is also a very bad dream and will pass. They only thing we can do is not to restate the problem over and over but to concentrate on the solution which is Krishna consciousness and to try a sow Krishna conscious seeds into the discussion where ever we can. The danger is in getting to sucked to this whirlpool of nastiness, this toliet bowl, ourselves and waste our valuable oppurtunity. We know the problem Bhakta Don but what is the solution? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 As long as we have these extremists - Bush and Co. - cultivating these other extremists they are going to present these dangers. If there is an 'Islamic' attempt to take over the world - it's only the karmic reactions to the evangelical attempts to do the same. There is not a problem with religion - there's a problem with some followers of religion. Quote: The future I see not too far down the road is a complete rejection by the free world of this religious zealousness to the point where the borders will no longer allow potential terrorists to enter. This would include all professing that religion. Reply: Well I doubt that anyone here in the west is going to speak out [loud enough to be heard] about the sick evangelical plans and what that means - if earth is to become so down on religions then we should look at ALL of them that are part of the problem - this struggle with these two groups is quite old now - but today's contentions are more political and economic guised as faith issues. Beware the evangelical potential for this domestic terror in years to come... So thank you for your posting.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 Quote: The protective class must act to protect those they are sworn to protect. Reply: Well that is true I ask that you consider this point - also posted by me on the ''origins of satan myth' thread: ...We know that 'war' cannot be entirely checked - but the fact is quarrel cannot - must not - be cultivated - neither by ill-dealing nor - by unfair and inequitable resources appropriations. "...the head of the state should never fail in chasing an enemy..." [sB 1.12.22, purport] Why shouldn't 'Heads of State' engage their peoples in turf wars? [...] "...Just like at the present moment the politicians, as soon as they see that they cannot manage things, in the country there is confusion, they declare some war so that the whole attention may be turned that side, and there will be no agitation of the internal dissatisfaction.(SB 1.15.25-26, lecture, 1973)" Isn' that exactly a part of what Bush and Co. have been doing?..." [Posted by me on 10/01/05] Quote: We know the problem Bhakta Don but what is the solution? Reply: The 'origins of the satan myth' thread thread isn't only focused on what is wrong - there are many many points from the Vani of Srila Prabhupada on the way past this. If you think that we can get the whole world chanting "hare krishna" - then you may be a bigger speculator than you think. You know as well as I do that most people are not going to chant - however - they may read Prabhupada's Vani and be changed - so as you know - it all starts with a 'hearing' - that 'hearing' is the basis for all the rest. Besides - I've made the point before - I made it in the 'origins of Satan myth' thread: ...We are not going to see everyone come to our platform - thus we cannot neglect that we can still have a great influence - especially if the other groups see our efforts as non-conversion orientated - it could inspire millions of people and make the Name of Krishna even more well respected among these other groups.... [posted by me on 08/20/05] Do you get the point now? What is the task before us? YS, BDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 ...the point is clear - try to educate the leaders... "...if you try to educate the mass of people to become educated to elect the right person, that is very difficult. But if a king, a person, is educated nicely, that is easier. That is my point of view..." [Room Conversation July 23, 1973] This is something we can do! With the internet we can create discussion threads and post the Vani there [and we can send emails to certain leaders - with links and invitations to visit]. Of course - we must not focus on individual leaders [with email preaching] - these thread postings are better and they tend to go beyond this limitation [of being directed at any one leader] and they may end up attracting enough attention to be read - before any stack of 'preachy' emails would be. Of course who we send these invitations to must be considered on many points [like - we don't interact with serpents] - I don't worry about sending invitations [yet] - the leaders shall find their way here - if they have to. But the point is - we can inundate the web with this 'education' that Srila Prabhupada speaks of in this noted conversation with Lord Fenner-Brockway. YS, BDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 Here in honor of Chanukah I post my animated Chanukkiah… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2006 Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 As long as we have these extremists - Bush and Co. - cultivating these other extremists they are going to present these dangers. If there is an 'Islamic' attempt to take over the world - it's only the karmic reactions to the evangelical attempts to do the same. This is very silly. I'm out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 It doesn't belong in world review - why are you fixated on that? What is the moving factor in the Bush faction? Can we deny that 25%+ of americans are self-identified as evangelical? You don't have to accept that they cultivating these issues - but they are. I am not the only only one on earth saying these things. Bush pretends to have the faith but clearly he doesn't. IF you don't see that the evangelicals are as intent on world-wide conversion then you don't see anything. If we are going to stamp out islamic extremist ideology then we cannot neglect the evanglelical cliunter-point. Quote: This is very silly. I'm out. Reply: Why? Oh bye [for now]... YS, BDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 In Britain, the government recently decided to deploy global positioning system (GPS) technology to track every vehicle in the U.K. every minute of the day. Just as GPS sensors are mandated for use in every cell phone in the near future in the United States (for our safety, of course), Britain will mandate the use of a GPS sensor in every car. ``Has Reginald White arrived at the grocery store yet?'' will become a question answerable by the security division of Britain's DMV. Read more: http://www.commondreams.org/views05/1229-35.htm Of course I'm already a victim of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2006 Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 It appears that this string is taking off nicely. A few more posts and we'll have 2 pages. From there, the sky's the limit. Maybe this generic string will surpass the 28 pages from the other thread. Sorry I don't have anything substantial to offer at this time. But, if it's a generic string, I assume it's okay just to drop in and say hi. I like generic strings. It's kinda neat. I repeat: it's neat. (Hey, it rhymes.) I hope that guest will return and help keep the string alive. He said he was "out." This thread (I mean string) may not last long if it's only me and you here, Bhakta Don. Anyway, have a nice day, and maybe I will stop by again in a couple of days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 Hari Bol! Hello! Quote: I assume it's okay just to drop in and say hi Reply: It sure is! I thought that generic might be good - we have a topic but it's kinda "generic" - as the issues are sort of generic too! Maybe the other thread was locked because it was 28 pages - which is alot to load. <big>You have a great day too!</big> YS, BDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 Ralph Reed, the former head of the influential Christian Coalition who has worked on seven U.S. presidential campaigns, spoke during the Canadian Values Conference, staged by the nascent Institute for Canadian Values at Canada Christian College in Toronto Nov. 29 – Dec. 1. Reed served as a senior adviser to the Bush campaign in 2000 and as the president’s southeast campaign chair in 2004. Greeted with a standing ovation, he told the crowd in Toronto that the recipe for social conservative success in the political sphere is not “rocket science” and emphasized two simple planks in the process – a commitment to unabashed social conservatism and grassroots activism. http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2005/dec/05121610.html Of course - the faith-based conservative party of Canada has their support reposed in this area as the evangelical slant is becoming very activist is Canada – as it is in the U.S. – Ralph Reed praises Stephen Harper at every opportunity and he and his are very keen to be involved in the rallying of the evangelical vote in canada. In Canada only around 8% self identify as evangelical – but there are many more ordinary Christians who may vote for Harper thinking they share the same values – the fact is they don’t. Without a doubt traditional churches are under siege by the evangelical churches – the propaganda is that the traditional churches have no connection to the true faith – most people who leave the traditional churches for other faith groups are going to these new evangelical churches – these are interesting points to consider as we see the serious politicization of religion in the west. Contrasted with them Middle East nations espousing theocracy - there are little differences within their ‘central delusions’ of extremist faith-based governances. Who wonders what sort of bent political rants are preached from the pulpits of these evangelical centers each Sunday? What bent things shall you be told if you enter discussion with them about political issues as a visitor to those centers? Naturally - none of these individuals see themselves as extremists – rather they see themselves as the only groups rightly situated. One could question what the Reed fellow is doing in Canada lobbying for the neo-conservatives – during a federal election. What right do they [conservatives] have to condemn people like me – when they are taking help from these U.S. evangelical extremists – in terms of training these little evangelical voters to be ‘Christian Activists’? Here in Canada we have a tricky situation now with an election and all this. Why do we have an election at this time? It is due to the NDP party who voted in . to bring down the Liberal minority government – why did they do it? The NDP know that they shall NOT form federal government in Ottawa - so why do the NDP think that they’ll have more success - with a ‘minority’ conservative government? Jack Layton claimed that the NDP 'lost confidence' in the Liberals – but again – he thus thinks that the conservatives shall not lose NDP confidence much quicker? Is left-leaning Jack Layton incompetent to understand what dealing with right-leaning Steven Harper is really going to be like - when he apparently cannot deal with the center-standing Paul Martin? Would people want to have a right-wing federal government in Ottawa - one that would indeed marginalize our security and our rights - by trying to ‘play their part’ with the so-called coalition of right-wing nations playing enforcer in our world – [outside the authority of the international community] - in it’s current manufactured extremist emergency? That scenario is what jack Layton’s NDP are contending for! Keep in mind that in Britain - the Left-wing Labour Party - under Tony Blair - is engaged as the left-hand of the noted 'coalition' which is usurping global resolve. We know that Left and Right wing governments - subjugate rights – publicly they decry rights abuses and pretend to eschew those who do those things – but - there is evidence right within their polices and ideologies and various governances which marginalize whole groups – while ‘nickel and diming’ individual rights and freedoms. To make it worse add the exclusivist and extremist faith-based factor… To that end I’ve produced two new posters: [What is the significance of the jack-in-the-box? Well they tend to be a scary and surprising type of toy – crank crank crank – out it pops – only in this case the surprise is even more scary – the left-wing NDP support for the right-wing conservative party of Canada] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2006 Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 why are you posting these here instead of posting them on world review forum? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 Why does it matter? The topic is "extremist spirituality" - this forum is "Spiritual Discussions" - thus it isn't out of context here. Part of spirituality for some involves these issues and the point of this thread is to present these issues as far as possible from the Vedic perspective. Spirituality is different than discussions of Krishna – which topic also has a dedicated forum here. I am not going into a pointless exchange with you on this - if you have some substance to discuss - as a result of the posting I made ok that we can discuss but ‘why this isn’t on the other forum’ - is a waste of bits and bytes. Take care! BDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 There it is moved - happy? Like it really matters - it'll be read here too! Take care! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2006 <big>United States Patent 5,629,678 Gargano , et al. May 13, 1997 Personal tracking and recovery system Abstract Apparatus for tracking and recovering humans utilizes an implantable transceiver incorporating a power supply and actuation system allowing the unit to remain implanted and functional for years without maintenance. The implanted transmitter may be remotely actuated, or actuated by the implantee. Power for the remote-activated receiver is generated electromechanically through the movement of body muscle. The device is small enough to be implanted in a child, facilitating use as a safeguard against kidnapping, and has a transmission range which also makes it suitable for wilderness sporting activities. A novel biological monitoring feature allows the device to be used to facilitate prompt medical dispatch in the event of heart attack or similar medical emergency. A novel sensation-feedback feature allows the implantee to control and actuate the device with certainty. [...] Appl. No.: 371089 Filed: January 10, 1995. From 'U.S. Patent' site</big>: http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?patentnumber=5629678 Read my more personal account here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2006 Report Share Posted January 3, 2006 just wandering what the canadian devotee's and iskcon temples are like in canada, since your from canada and all. bhakta bob. agtsp. thankyou. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2006 Well there is a lot of work to be done - the temples are fading away due to neglect of the preaching - things are not what they were 40 years ago and there are still people in ISKCON living in that past - trying to relate to the public in the same fashion. Much like the temples anywhere else there is politics which isn't good at all. But when all is said and done there are many many many great devotees here in Canada. Hope this answers your question. YS, BDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2006 Report Share Posted January 3, 2006 how to escape them. would you say things are tense there with the devotee's or most are relaxed and easy going apart from the authority devotees etc etc politics etc etc. just inquiring as i may pass through for a wee peak between places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2006 ...it's laid back - but put down roots and you may find out what I'm saying... but we have to keep 'the boat' as it were - it may be leaking but - if we jump out the boat then what? If you visit a temple - I think you will find it pleasant as you would likley find the devotees pleasant - so indeed do drop into a temple! Depending on the city you're considering a visit to - you may have to call ahead and make arrangements to see the temple as some [like here] are not open all day everyday. I encourage you to stop and have a 'peek'... YS, BDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhakta Don Muntean Posted January 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2006 Report Share Posted January 3, 2006 when u say /// but put down roots and you may find out what I'm saying... /// do u mean tyr to live there. and are u talking about the government or the devotees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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