Bush - the greatest danger facing US

[Kulapavana]

<TABLE><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top>Source: Times</TD></TR><TR><TD> </TD><TD vAlign=top>Published: March 16, 2006 Author: Sam Knight</TD></TR><TR><TD> </TD><TD vAlign=top>.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

 

<!-- ZOG says Iran and Syria going to get it, Israel will watch -->America will continue to pre-emptively attack its enemies and Iran is now the greatest danger facing the United States, George Bush announced today in a new version of his "National Security Strategy".

 

In the 49-page document released four days before the third anniversary of the American -led invasion of Iraq, Mr Bush gave a resolute, upbeat account of the ongoing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and said his Administration would continue to confront states before they had a chance to attack America or develop nuclear weapons.

 

"Our strong preference and common practice is to address proliferation concerns through international diplomacy, in concert with key allies and regional partners," he wrote.

 

"If necessary, however, under long-standing principles of self defense, we do not rule out the use of force before attacks occur, even if uncertainty remains as to the time and place of the enemy’s attack."

 

Mr Bush said that the September 11 attacks had "underscored the danger of allowing threats to linger unresolved", and although he conceded that the intelligence that had led to the war in Iraq was wrong, he insisted that the strategy of attacking threatening nations and groups before they could harm America was valid.

 

In a broad study of the global security situation, in which Mr Bush identified economic progress and free trade as important catalysts for democracy, the US President singled out Iran as the clearest, present threat to stability.

 

"We may face no greater challenge from a single country than from Iran," he wrote, after describing the clerical regime in Tehran as an "enemy of freedom, justice, and peace".

 

Mr Bush accused Iran of masking its nuclear intentions for almost 20 years, wilfully disrupting negotiations with the international community and meddling in Iraq.

 

"The Iranian regime sponsors terrorism; threatens Israel; seeks to thwart Middle East peace; disrupts democracy in Iraq; and denies the aspirations of its people for freedom," he wrote.

 

"The nuclear issue and our other concerns can ultimately be resolved only if the Iranian regime makes the strategic decision to change these policies, open up its political system, and afford freedom to its people. This is the ultimate goal of U.S. policy."

 

Mr Bush's report, an update of a security strategy he wrote in 2002, set the White House's War on Terror in the grand tradition of American foreign policy.

 

He compared the ideological battle against radical Islam to the Cold War and said the decision to take the fight to the enemy reminded him of decisions made by Ronald Reagan during the 1980s and Harry Truman immediately after the Second World War.

 

"The path we have chosen is consistent with the great tradition of American foreign policy. Like the policies of Harry Truman and Ronald Reagan, our approach is idealistic about our nation's goals, and realistic about the means to achieve them."

 

Alongside Iran, Mr Bush identified North Korea and Syria as two other troublesome nations. He accused Kim Jong Il of running a regime in Pyongyang that poses a nuclear threat to the US, starves its people, counterfeits money and traffics drugs. Syria, he wrote, oppressed its people and sponsored terrorism.

 

Mr Bush said that America was keen to strengthen its relations with Russia and China, its two Cold War adversaries, but rebuked both for their uncertain commitment to democratic reform.

 

Russia, he complained, was impeding the spread of democracy in the former Soviet Union. "Recent trends regrettably point toward a diminishing commitment to democratic freedoms and institutions," he wrote. "We will work to try to persuade the Russian Government to move forward, not backward, along freedom’s path."

 

China, for its part, was accused of building up its armed forces "in a non-transparent way" and of pursuing trading relationships with countries with poor human rights records. Mr Bush said China would be forced to offer more freedoms to its people and prosperity increased but that America would be prepared if Beijing continued to deny reform.

 

"Our strategy seeks to encourage China to make the right strategic choices for its people, while we hedge against other possibilities," he wrote.

 

Mr Bush's security strategy was published as the American President is bedevilled by the worst approval ratings of his five years in office and calls from his own party to introduce fresh faces to a White House apparently unable to shrug off a series of scandals.

 

The Bush Administration has also been accused of being shorn of ideas for withdrawing US troops from Iraq. Yesterday, a ten-member panel of foreign policy experts was formed to describe the state of the war after the US Congress said it needed "an honest assessment of where we are and how we go forward and take this out of politics".

[Guest guest]

Either jefferson or franklin are credited with the following.

 

When the government fears the people, this is democracy. When the people fear the government, this is tyranny.

 

So those who can discern reality from the departure from the TRUE in today's society, answer this question and see what the USA is.

 

Some may say they dont fear the government, but they are liars as well, because their fearlessness comes from being sycopants, echoing the line despite what is coming from their hearts. They love a government which rules with the greatest terrorism the earth has ever known? Or maybe they thing "collateral damage" of a million non-combatants in Iraq since 1991 starved, blown to shreds, etc, is okay. They think killing thousands to take 40 prisoners is cool. They think that to destroy a population of Iraqis who bore no malice to the west is righteous resolution of criminals, all from other nations, mostly ones allied with the US, who killed 3,000 in NYC on 9-11-01.

 

Read shastra. See what the spiritual opinion is of those who cannot control their weapons and kill innocents (i.e. Aswattama). See how one who shoots a deer by mistake is dealt with. Please, vaisnavas, dont be brainwashed by the murderous agents of kali yuga into embracing their crimes against humanity, or just say zig heil and have a good life. Just dont make a foolish mistake, like chanting in the street the names of a God considered false by the fascists who will kill without regard even for your support.

 

And, BTW, you heard it first here, the WMD is wielded by the USA, the next mushroom cloud will be US made, fired in anger without regard for the consequences. After all, even Oppenheimer feared that the first test would set off a chain reaction that would destroy the world, but we fired it anyway, just like Aswattama who unleashed the brahmastra even though he had no control of it.

 

haribol, mahaksadasa

[kcp1982]

In march 2001 when the Taliban destroyed the Dieties of Lord Buddha, I was praying that Lord Buddha takes revenge on the barbaric Taliban. My prayers were answered. By Nov 2001, nearly all the Taliban were destroyed in the same way they destroyed the Lord Buddha dieties. Blown out of caves.

 

It was George Bush who ordered the Taliban to be destroyed. All glories to him.

 

Lord Buddha used George Bush as an instrument to destroy the Taliban. He will continue to use him as an instrument to destroy all the evil terrorists of the world. All glories to him.

[Guest guest]

I've been trying to say this since 9-11 but you worry me. I wish you didn't. I wish when I walked down the streets of this country that I love, that your color and culture still blended with the beautiful human landscape we enjoy in this country. But you don't blend in anymore. I notice you, and it worries me. I notice you because I can't help it anymore. People from your homelands, professing to be Muslims, have been attacking and killing my fellow citizens and our friends for more than 20 years now. I don't fully understand their grievances and hate but I know that nothing can justify the inhumanity of their attacks.

 

On September 11, nineteen ARAB-MUSLIMS hijacked four jetliners in my country. They cut the throats of women in front of children and brutally stabbed to death others. They took control of those planes and crashed them into buildings killing thousands of proud fathers, loving sons, wise grandparents, elegant daughters, best friends, favorite coaches, fearless public servants, and children's mothers. The Palestinians celebrated, The Iraqis were overjoyed as was most of the Arab world.

 

So I notice you now. I don't want to be worried. I don't want to be consumed by the same rage and hate and prejudice that has destroyed the soul of these terrorists. But I need your help. As a rational American, trying to protect my country and family in an irrational and unsafe world, I must know how to tell the difference between you, and the Arab/Muslim terrorist.

 

How do I differentiate between the true Arab/Muslim-Americans and the Arab/Muslims in our communities who are attending our schools, enjoying our parks, and living in OUR communities under the protection of OUR constitution, while they plot the next attack that will slaughter these same good neighbors and children? The events of September 11th changed the answer. It is not my responsibility to determine which of you embraces our great country, with ALL of its religions, with ALL of its different citizens, with all of its faults. It is time for every Arab/Muslim in this country to determine it for me.

 

I want to know, I demand to know, and I have a right to k now whether or not you love America. Do you pledge allegiance to its flag? Do you proudly display it in front of your house, or on your car?

 

Do you pray in your many daily prayers that Allah will bless this nation, that He will protect and prosper it? Or do you pray that Allah with destroy it in one of your "Jihads"? Are you thankful for the freedom that only this nation affords? A freedom that was paid for by the blood of hundreds of thousands of patriots who gave their lives for this country? Are you willing to preserve this freedom by paying the ultimate sacrifice? Do you love America? If this is your commitment, then I need YOU to start letting ME know about it.

 

Your Muslim leaders in this nation should be flooding the media at this time with hard facts on your faith, and what hard actions you are taking as a community and as a religion to protect the United States of America. Please, no more benign overtures of regret for the death of the innocent because I worry about who you regard as innocent. No more benign overtures of condemnation for the unprovoked attacks because I worry about what is unprovoked to you. I am not interested in any more sympathy...I am only interested in action. What will you do for America - our great country -- at this time of crisis, at this time of war?

 

I want to see Arab-Muslims waving the AMERICAN flag in the streets. I want to hear you chanting "Allah Bless America". I want to see young Arab/Muslim men enlisting in the military. I want to see a commitment of money, time, and emotion to the victims of this butchering and to this nation as a whole. The FBI has a list of over 400 people they want to talk to regarding the WTC attack. Many of these people live and socialize in Muslim communities. You know them; You know where they are.

 

Hand them over to us, now! But I have seen little even approaching this sort of action. Instead I have seen an already closed and secretive community close even tighter. You have disappeared from the streets. You have posted armed security guards at your facilities. You have threatened lawsuits. You have screamed for protection from reprisals.

 

The very few Arab/Muslim representatives that HAVE appeared in the media were defensive and equivocating. They seemed more concerned with making sure that the United States proves who was responsible before taking action. They seemed more concerned with protecting their fellow Muslims from violence directed towards them in the United States and abroad than they did with supporting our country and denouncing "leaders" like Khadafi, Hussein, Farrakhan, and Arafat. If the true teachings of Islam proclaim tolerance and peace and love for all people then I w ant chapter and verse from the Koran and statements from popular Muslim leaders to back it up. What good is it if the teachings in the Koran are good and pure and true when your "leaders" are teaching fanatical interpretations, terrorism, and intolerance?

 

It matters little how good Islam SHOULD BE if large numbers of the world's Muslims interpret the teachings of Mohammed incorrectly and adhere to a degenerative form of the religion. A form that has been demonstrated to us over and over again. A form whose structure is built upon a foundation of violence, death, and suicide. A form whose members are recruited from the prisons around the world. A form whose members (some as young as five years old) are seen day after day, week in and week out, year after year, marching in the streets around the world, burning effigies of our presidents, burning the American flag, shooting weapons into the air. A form whose members convert from a peaceful religion, only to take up arms against the great United States of America, the country of their birth. A form whose rules are so twisted, that their traveling members refuse to show their faces at airport security checkpoints, in the name of Islam.

 

Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because our women proudly show their faces in public rather than cover up like a shameful whore? Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because we drink wine with dinner, or celebrate Christmas? Do you and you fellow Muslims hate us because we have befriended Israel, the ONLY civilized democratic nation in the entire Middle East?

 

And if you and your fellow Muslims hate us, then why in the world are you even here? Are you here to take our money? Are you here to undermine our peace and stability? Are you here to destroy us? If so, I want you to leave I want you to go back to your desert sandpit where women are treated like rats and dogs. I want you to take your religion, your friends, and your family back to your Islamic extremists, and STAY THERE! We will NEVER give in to your influence, your retarded mentality, your twisted, violent, intolerant religion. We will NEVER allow the attacks of September 11, or any others for that matter, to take away that which is so precious to us: Our rights under the greatest constitution in the world. I want to know where every Arab/ Muslim in this country stands and I think it is my right and the right of every true citizen of this country to demand it. A right paid for by the blood of thousands of my brothers and sisters who died protecting the very constitution that is protecting you and your family. I am pleading with you to let me know. I want you here as my brother, my neighbor, my friend, as a fellow American. But there can be no gray areas or ambivalence regarding your allegiance and it is up to YOU to show ME where YOU stand. Until then ...you worry me.

[Kulapavana]

"Mr Bush accused Iran of masking its nuclear intentions for almost 20 years, wilfully disrupting negotiations with the international community and meddling in Iraq.

 

"The Iranian regime sponsors terrorism; threatens Israel; seeks to thwart Middle East peace; disrupts democracy in Iraq; and denies the aspirations of its people for freedom," he wrote. "

-------

 

Iran is a threat to US just like Iraq had weapons of mass destruction... it's all lies, told to benefit certain special interests...

 

so... who has more innocent people's blood on their hands?

[D B Cooper Jr]

The coming destruction is why I have always agreed with the philosophy of Jim Morrison when he said "I am going to get my kicks in before the whole sh*thouse goes up in flames." Nah just kidding. I have respect for the Krsna conscious philosophy which is not self indulgent like that. The thing I don't get about you Krishna Conscious conspiracy buffs is even if Bush is this great devil that you say he is, in Krsna Conscious philosophy I was under the understanding that not even a blade of grass moves without Krsna's sanction so none of these devils can actually destroy the world without Krsna's approval and support? Maybe I am misunderstanding something or something because I admit I am an idiot.

 

Don't get me wrong you conspiracy theorists very well maybe right but I am not convinced one way or another.

[D B Cooper Jr]

I don't mean any disrespect but you guys think so much about George Bush that you both might end up being reincarnated as George Bush in your next life. Just kidding.

[Apep]

 

In march 2001 when the Taliban destroyed the Dieties of Lord Buddha, I was praying that Lord Buddha takes revenge on the barbaric Taliban. My prayers were answered. By Nov 2001, nearly all the Taliban were destroyed in the same way they destroyed the Lord Buddha dieties. Blown out of caves.

It was George Bush who ordered the Taliban to be destroyed. All glories to him.

Lord Buddha used George Bush as an instrument to destroy the Taliban. He will continue to use him as an instrument to destroy all the evil terrorists of the world. All glories to him.

The enemy of your enemy is not so sweet. The enemy of your enemy is not so caring. In the end the enemy of your enemy is still wicked in nature.

George Bush is no saviour, nor is his administration. They seek globalization and financial gain at the expenses of others. They could careless of divine law.

Please re-think this over.

[Apep]

 

"Mr Bush accused Iran of masking its nuclear intentions for almost 20 years, wilfully disrupting negotiations with the international community and meddling in Iraq.

"The Iranian regime sponsors terrorism; threatens Israel; seeks to thwart Middle East peace; disrupts democracy in Iraq; and denies the aspirations of its people for freedom," he wrote. "

-------

Iran is a threat to US just like Iraq had weapons of mass destruction... it's all lies, told to benefit certain special interests...

so... who has more innocent people's blood on their hands?

The Iranian nuclear weapon threat is just a political ploy or exscuse of invading Iran. Israel has nuclear missles that can reach Europe in only hours time. Israel also has nuclear missles that can reach most middle eastern countries.

The Israeli circle in Washington has alot of political influence and George Bush is under it.

It is a no-brainer.

Also Israel twarted the peace on the day of it's establishment in the 1960's killing innocent Palestinians.

You will find every story has it's attributes.

[Apep]

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

In march 2001 when the Taliban destroyed the Dieties of Lord Buddha, I was praying that Lord Buddha takes revenge on the barbaric Taliban. My prayers were answered. By Nov 2001, nearly all the Taliban were destroyed in the same way they destroyed the Lord Buddha dieties. Blown out of caves.

It was George Bush who ordered the Taliban to be destroyed. All glories to him.

Lord Buddha used George Bush as an instrument to destroy the Taliban. He will continue to use him as an instrument to destroy all the evil terrorists of the world. All glories to him.

AMEN TO THAT!

 

THE CRIMINAL TALIBAN:smash: MURTI AND MURTI SENDS SOMEONE TO TALIBAN...

 

I too prayed that nasty things would happen to them after they did that - I saw that act of violence toward the giant Murti of Him that taught non-violence - as an act of violence toward God and all humanity.

 

These taliban losers are cursed by their own crass evil. They shall be hunted and eliminated because that is what must be done.

 

Myself - I would never accept any so-called change of heart of a terrorist with blood [or other's sufferings induced by them] on their hands.

 

Terrorists are nasty radicals who employ any form of terror - as a political weapon - cockroaches who usually infest in concert with other cockroach terrorists - they too often use religion as a cover [and excuse] for terrorist activities and that is where God shall see them - on the run right through to their end.

 

Maharaja Parakit would certainly hunt down these losers and do the job - there is no question of the coalition's need to do this - in the spirit of a proper 'leader' like maharaja Parakit.

 

We must pray that our western leaders take this mission in this light...

 

BDM

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

[Streetstraw]

 

Actually, Chaindog's much worse.

There's a famous Reggae song, i don't exactly know the words, it goes something like this:

"Pass the ______ on dee left hand side

Pass the ______ on dee left hand side"

Anyway, just fill in these words instead:

"9/11 was an inside job

9/11 was an inside job"

Israel is a propped-up failure, though it might flourish elsewhere.

Einstein & Hitler did agree in one thing:

Israel should not b set up where it is today.

Mohammed must've been a partial incarnation of Lord Siva (also SankarAcarya's contempory) bent on destroying Vedic Culture thus furthering Kaliyuga confusion.

Best aspects of Islam I know of:

1) No pig eating (Mohammed should have banned animal slaughter & carcass-eating altogether)

2) Polygamy (all women s/b protected at all 3 stages: daughter wife mother)

[Kulapavana]

it is actually amazing, that there are still Krishna devotees supporting Bush... well, and then again... some still think Kirtanananda is a pure devotee...

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

it is actually amazing, that there are still Krishna devotees supporting Bush... well, and then again... some still think Kirtanananda is a pure devotee...

 

What's more amazing is that I didn't support Mr. Bush and - now I do!

 

 

As for that Kirtanananda - he is - was and - ever shall be - a loser - a judas - an perversion. He was permitted by Krishna - as an example for all time - of the results of guru aparadha [offense] and - other capital sins towards others within the community of devotees.

 

ys,

 

BDM

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

Actually, Chaindog's much worse.

There's a famous Reggae song, i don't exactly know the words, it goes something like this:

"Pass the ______ on dee left hand side

Pass the ______ on dee left hand side"

Anyway, just fill in these words instead:

"9/11 was an inside job

9/11 was an inside job"

Israel is a propped-up failure, though it might flourish elsewhere.

Einstein & Hitler did agree in one thing:

Israel should not b set up where it is today.

Mohammed must've been a partial incarnation of Lord Siva (also SankarAcarya's contempory) bent on destroying Vedic Culture thus furthering Kaliyuga confusion.

Best aspects of Islam I know of:

1) No pig eating (Mohammed should have banned animal slaughter & carcass-eating altogether)

2) Polygamy (all women s/b protected at all 3 stages: daughter wife mother)

 

 

[Kulapavana]

 

What's more amazing is that I didn't support Mr. Bush and - now I do!

 

 

why am I not surprised at this? lol! one look at your threads is all it takes...

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

why am I not surprised at this? lol! one look at your threads is all it takes...

Hari Bolo!

 

Yah I'm not much surprised by your lack of vision either - not much surprised that in all of our discussions - in my satan myth thread you failed to defend your position on very important points. You are a obviously a very materialistic person.

 

I wonder who you think should deal a blow to these fascists in Iran Syria Hamas etc., etc., - who? Russia and China?

 

How do you think a ksatryia would act in this regard - would he wait for the demons and the problems - to become unmanageable before acting?

 

Who can deny that there is a threat that is spreading via some 'Islamic' fascist types? Just look at Africa to see their MO.

 

No doubt Bush isn't perfectly situated - but - he is more well positioned than Clinton was - he is more so than Kerry would have been.

 

Give us examples of the three worst things about him and we can then contrast it to the other guys.

 

YS,

 

BDM

 

PS:

 

You're a 'Senior Member' based ONLY on the number of postings you've posted!

[Kulapavana]

 

You are a obviously a very materialistic person.

 

yes. so?

 

 

I wonder who you think should deal a blow to these fascists in Iran Syria Hamas etc., etc., - who?

 

whoever feels threatened by them should deal with that threat and pay for it in their own money and their own blood. they are not a threat to US.

 

 

How do you think a ksatryia would act in this regard - would he wait for the demons and the problems - to become unmanageable before acting?

 

real kshatriya is a person of honor and justice. a person who simply carries a big sick is a gunda, criminal lowlife. being a kshatriya is primarily about administering JUSTICE and not about forcing people to submit to your whims.

 

 

 

Give us examples of the three worst things about him

 

1. he is directly responsible for tens of thousands innocent lives lost in Iraq. he killed much more people than Binladen.

 

2. he started an extremely costly and needless war, that only made US the most hated country in the world and thus created more threat to US interests.

 

3. he is a confirmed liar and a crook, serving the interests of international capital owners, not American people

 

 

You're a 'Senior Member' based ONLY on the number of postings you've posted!

 

yes, so?

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

yes. so?

 

 

 

whoever feels threatened by them should deal with that threat and pay for it in their own money and their own blood. they are not a threat to US.

 

 

 

real kshatriya is a person of honor and justice. a person who simply carries a big sick is a gunda, criminal lowlife. being a kshatriya is primarily about administering JUSTICE and not about forcing people to submit to your whims.

 

 

 

 

1. he is directly responsible for tens of thousands innocent lives lost in Iraq. he killed much more people than Binladen.

 

2. he started an extremely costly and needless war, that only made US the most hated country in the world and thus created more threat to US interests.

 

3. he is a confirmed liar and a crook, serving the interests of international capital owners, not American people

 

 

 

yes, so?

 

Quote:

 

whoever feels threatened by them should deal with that threat and pay for it in their own money and their own blood. they are not a threat to US.

 

Reply:

 

But they are a threat to the U.S. - they are a threat to YOU. You mention Gunda [criminal] in your posting - and these terrorists are not criminals with big sticks - trying to enforce their 'conversion' plans on the world?

 

They are a direct threat to so many - at what point do you decide that it is prudent to help do something [if even just to well wish your leaders in this struggle?] - to check their advancement? Do you wait till they are bearing directly down on you? That might be too late?

 

I think that when these losers did what they did on 9/11 - there was no doubt of their intent to the U.S. and - the rest of the west.

 

Quote:

 

real kshatriya is a person of honor and justice. a person who simply carries a big sick is a gunda, being a kshatriya is primarily about administering JUSTICE and not about forcing people to submit to your whims.

 

Reply:

 

Honor and justice. Nice words in kali yuga.

 

Indeed - the words have seemingly taken leave from the modern lexicon - but - to say that the Bush admin. has nothing in terms of these - for a motive - isn't fair.

 

On the issue of forcing the submission of peoples - again - I would note that these Taliban freaks cannot be overlooked - just see what they did in Afganistan!

 

Of course these issues are there in other related regimes as well and - there seems to be a growing desire by these types - to bully the world into their version of Islam - bully people - with terror.

 

I for one think that we have to see that in terms of the criminal lowlife mindset in which it is.

 

There presently isn't any greater political threats - from thugs - as needs to be seriously and fully redressed - as this thug progrom.

 

My point was that a proper leader would go after them - yes - that isn't a popular approach in today's politically correct global strife arenas but - it is nonetheless necessary.

 

Over time the west is going to have to deal with MUCH MORE of this [if not checked now] - what to speak of when the communists in China decide to move out over the world - [don't scoff at that too] so - we need our western leaders to see that they themselves do have to become free of duplicity and - fight the good fight.

 

Quote:

 

1. he is directly responsible for tens of thousands innocent lives lost in Iraq. he killed much more people than Binladen.

 

Reply:

 

Well the truth is - that war was necessary.

 

Even though I didn't agree with it in March 2003 - I do certainly accept that it was needed.

 

The fact is we may never know what disputed weapons were taken into Syria when the Russians tipped 'sodamninsane' of his impending moment with 'justice'.

 

He was and is a thug and - we have entered the era of the need to change regimes and - by force - at times.

 

These nations - Iran Iraq Syria [and groups like Hamas and the Taliban] - they interfere in the business of other nations and - they are sending out their own 'crusaders' - into Africa - to slaughter the people there - again - to bully them - with terror - into submission to their militant version of Isalm.

 

How many people has Binladen ruined?

 

How many people's hearts and minds has he corrupted with his sick evil? You think about that.

 

Wonder too - did 'sodamninsane' support this terror agenda? He did.

 

How many murderers has Binladen created?

 

How many terrorists are spawning due to him and his pogrom?

 

I agree that there should be less death in Iraq and - for that - there needs to be an end to the insurgency - if that ends - then the war in effect - shall stop.

 

It isn't the coalition forces who are responsible for the insurgency!

 

Do the terrorists think that if they can slaughter enough people and - if they can terrorize the minds and hearts of the Iraqi people long enough - that the coalition shall just give up and go away?

 

Well I don't see how nature shall permit that to go on - they and their beheadings and other heinous acts - are the very acts of DISHONOR that shall bring the justice of defeat - onto their own heads.

 

NO - Bush isn't responsible for all that carnage.

 

Quote:

 

2. he started an extremely costly and needless war, that only made US the most hated country in the world and thus created more threat to US interests.

 

Reply:

 

The people who hate the U.S. because of this war - already hated the U.S. - that is why we have this war!

 

Yes it is costly and - I think that the OIL RICH Arab Nations - like Saudi Arabia - aught to pay thir part for this problem - one that has its origins there.

 

For example - they can take less profits on the oil they are selling - the oil is costing so much [due to this needed action] - as they profit from a war - caused by a group which operated out of that nation and - one that has its origins - in that nation.

 

I think that America aught to be Blessed for spending so much [of course the money is nothing compared to the lives spent on this] - when others are not.

 

Quote:

 

3. he is a confirmed liar and a crook, serving the interests of international capital owners, not American people

 

Reply:

 

Well all leaders lie. Is he really a crook? Aren't we all to some measure - unless we are pure devotees?

 

Yes - Mr. Bush is serving the interests of many different groups and individuals and - it is here now that he needs to start to evaluate his own interests - in terms of the success of the objective to his 'mission' - time to find out and - make changes to key points in foreign and domestic policy [the undemocratic and reasonless multi-billion dollar war on marijuana for example].

 

We cannot all sit around and complain about this war on terror and this state of affairs without understanding what is really going on and - why.

 

We need to understand that we are indeed in perilous times and - it is going to take full and complete western resolve - to fight this.

 

We have to fight against people who think that they are going to go to heaven for murdering you and - if they have to die in the process - all the better in their bent minds!

 

So of course - when fighting - normal sane people don't wish to think of their own lives in that way [kindlings for radical change] - normal fighters - normal solidiers - wish to preserve their lives - that is why one fights [to preserve life from a clear and present threat] but - that isn't why the noted thugs fight and - I'm sure that you must understand this.

 

They will die to kill and - that makes them a clear and present danger. What will they die to kill for? That adds the urgency factor to the issue!

 

There are a number of key changes our western conservative leaders need to make - both in foreign and domestic policy - to be better disposed to success in this important struggle.

 

One is compared to the lion when one is very strong in chasing an enemy. One should be a lamb at home and a lion in the chase. The lion never fails in the chase of an animal; similarly, the head of the state should never fail in chasing an enemy. [sB 1.12.22, purport]

 

“The ksatriya’s duty is to protect the citizens from all kinds of difficulties, and for that reason he has to apply violence in suitable cases for law and order. Therefore he has to conquer the soldiers of inimical kings, and thus, with religious principles, he should rule over the world.” [bG 2.32, purport]

 

The yogi should meditate upon His club, which is named Kaumodaki and is very dear to Him. This club smashes the demons, who are always inimical soldiers, and is smeared with their blood. [...] [sB 3.28.28] [read the purport to see our Lord's angry disposition to those who revile His pastimes]

 

On the issue of being materialistic:

 

One who offers Me respect but is envious of the bodies of others and is therefore a separatist never attains peace of mind, because of his inimical behavior towards other living entities. [sB 3.29.23]

 

The bodily expression of a particular type of living entity is always ignored by the devotee. [sB 3.29.23, purport]

 

I'm sure you know all this already prabhu.

 

Ys,

 

BDM

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

The coming destruction is why I have always agreed with the philosophy of Jim Morrison when he said "I am going to get my kicks in before the whole sh*thouse goes up in flames." Nah just kidding. I have respect for the Krsna conscious philosophy which is not self indulgent like that. The thing I don't get about you Krishna Conscious conspiracy buffs is even if Bush is this great devil that you say he is, in Krsna Conscious philosophy I was under the understanding that not even a blade of grass moves without Krsna's sanction so none of these devils can actually destroy the world without Krsna's approval and support? Maybe I am misunderstanding something or something because I admit I am an idiot.

 

Don't get me wrong you conspiracy theorists very well maybe right but I am not convinced one way or another.

 

I have respect for the Krsna conscious philosophy which is not self indulgent like that. The thing I don't get about you Krishna Conscious conspiracy buffs is even if Bush is this great devil that you say he is, in Krsna Conscious philosophy I was under the understanding that not even a blade of grass moves without Krsna's sanction so none of these devils can actually destroy the world without Krsna's approval and support?

 

Yes that is true...

 

That some shall try to destroy the world - isn't God's desire - nor is it His arrangement - He preserves the world - often by checking demoniac leaders and their followers.

 

If God seems to permit these terrorists to wreak havok isn't that like saying He is sanctioning it? No - God doesn't sanction these nasty things.

 

Prabhupada gives the example of the state - the business of the state is to see to the good maintenance of the citizens - but - the state has to also build prision houses.

 

Is it thus taken that the state wishes that people should go to the prison house? Of course not.

 

In the same manner we should know that God oversees the reactions to our deeds - collective and individually and - He may appear to sanction various thugs and their mahem but - we must see things - from a broad perspective - we need to see His sanctions - as the Conductor of karma.

 

We can see that God may permit bad things to happen and - it most certainly would be the most dangerous gambling to ignore dangers on the plea that they are God sanctioned reactions to karma.

 

It is EVIL to think that God may permit one to do bad things to innocent people - on the plea that they are God sanctioned reactions to their karma/actions! How often do losers do some nasty thing and then say that their victims deserved it?

 

We should understand that God wants us to become free of all karma especially bad karma.

 

He wants us avert nasty reactions and to do this we at times have to confront ourselves and - at times we have to confront each other - in any case there is going to be confrontations in the metting out of reactive experiances it's all in how we react to these confrontations.

 

Bad people will most certianly confront others - but never themselves.

 

You have correct vision of this point.

 

We have to see that God is in control - no matter what He is conducting in our reality.

 

Here is what He says to Arjuna:

 

The intricacies of action are very hard to understand. Therefore one should know properly what action is, what forbidden action is, and what inaction is. [bG 4.17]

 

Though engaged in all kinds of activities, My devotee, under My protection, reaches the eternal and imperishable abode by My grace. [bG 18.56]

 

Consider this point - how it relates to murderers and capital punishment.

 

If the state doesn't hang a confirmed murderer then they are making it necessary for a murderer to be born to take the future life of that one not hanged. The state is not murdering a person with such an punishment.

 

...a man who has committed murder should be hanged and his own life sacrificed in atonement. Previously this system was followed all over the world, but since people are becoming atheists, they are stopping capital punishment. This is not wise. Herein it is said that a physician who knows how to diagnose a disease prescribes medicine accordingly. If the disease is very serious, the medicine must be strong. The weight of a murderer’s sin is very great, and therefore according to Manu-samhita a murderer must be killed. By killing a murderer the government shows mercy to him because if a murderer is not killed in this life, he will be killed and forced to suffer many times in future lives. Since people do not know about the next life and the intricate workings of nature, they manufacture their own laws, but they should properly consult the established injunctions of the Sastras and act accordingly. [sB 6.1.8, purport]

 

YS,

 

BDM

[Kulapavana]

 

On the issue of being materialistic:

 

One who offers Me respect but is envious of the bodies of others and is therefore a separatist never attains peace of mind, because of his inimical behavior towards other living entities. [sB 3.29.23]

 

The bodily expression of a particular type of living entity is always ignored by the devotee. [sB 3.29.23, purport]

 

I'm sure you know all this already prabhu.

 

Ys,

 

BDM

 

 

maybe you should start applying your good advice to yourself and your posts here? show me by your own example...

 

are you suggesting that my materialism shows because I dont share your partiality to Israel when it comes to issues of ME politics? LOL!

 

get a grip on reality BDM...

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

maybe you should start applying your good advice to yourself and your posts here? show me by your own example...

 

are you suggesting that my materialism shows because I dont share your partiality to Israel when it comes to issues of ME politics? LOL!

 

get a grip on reality BDM...

 

 

 

It ain't just Israel you dislike - it's Jews and anything Jewish. Yup - it's the biblical tradition itself you despise.

 

Just try to show me where I'm being materialistic....

 

I have a grip - it's you who fail to understand Prabhupada's teachings!

 

YS,

 

BDM

[Guest guest]

 

It ain't just Israel you dislike - it's Jews and anything Jewish...

 

whatever, dude... I like bagels... and matzos

 

 

but seriously... you should examine your own feelings towards Arabs and Islam for starters. once you get off your high horse, I might be able to explain something to you...

[Kulapavana]

that was me... I have no idea why I have to keep logging in every time I post, even when staying on the site all the time... it's quite annoying...