Confused: hindu? Hare Krishna? Shivaism?

[ThusArtThou]

Hello:

As a spiritual seeker and a new devotee to to-to what? I don't know what I am a devotee to; Is Krishna conciousnessness merely a cult? Is it different from "conventional Hinduism"? Can Krishna be worshiped not as "Hare Krishna's" and the ISKON following? Can I go to the local temple and worship with "ethnic" Hindus? am I welcome? Please forgive me, I know I must sound and seem foolish but I am trying not to be disrespectful or foolish, I am lost and confused. I want to pursue the sense of spiritual growth and satisfaction I feel when I read the Bhagavad Gita and the Upanishads---moving soul-shifting words: ...From his light all these give light, and his radiance illumines all creation...

What is truth? What is cult? does Hinduism break into "religions" such as Catholicism, Protestanism, Lutheran? I Think you understand what my question is...

[Guest guest]

I only have a few minutes, so my reply will be brief, but I am sure that other users will add to my response, making it complete. First of all, you will be welcome at any temple regardless of the specifics of your beliefs. Hinduism is like a melting pot; it welcomes new thoughts and new beliefs. Criticism and disagreement are welcomed as they are proof that we, as Hindus, are searching for the Truth, which is the ultimate goal of Hinduism. The beliefs among Hindus are varied - most are monotheistic, but some are polytheistic. Most believe in reincarnation, but some don't. Some belief Siva (Saivism) is the ultimate deity, others believe Vishnu (Vishnaivism) is, and still others are parts of other sects of Hinduism. Because of this wide variety of beliefs, I don't really know if there is a such thing as conventional Hinduism.

 

If you feel a connection towards Krishna and the Bhagavad Gita, I would point you towards Vishnaivism, a sect of Hinduism which believes in the incarnations of Vishnu, including Krishna. Vishnaivites tend to be heavy in the use of statues and the studies of saints. The Rig Veda and the Upanishads are the central texts for Saivism. They Saivites tend to be more heavily immersed in mysticism. Of course, you are welcome to read and enjoy all the religious texts of Hinduism and any other religion thereof regardless of what branch of Hinduism you practice.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by "break into" other religions. Could you clarify your question? I hope I have answered some of your questions. Continue on your journey toward Truth and Self-Realization.

[Guest guest]

Cult as described by Merriam Webster

 

1 : formal religious veneration : WORSHIP

2 : a system of religious beliefs and ritual; also : its body of adherents

3 : a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious; also : its body of adherents

4 : a system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator <health cults>

5 a : great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work (as a film or book); especially : such devotion regarded as a literary or intellectual fad b : a usually small group of people characterized by such devotion

 

Most of the above meanings indicate it is not incorrect to classify iskcon as a cult, althought this is not necessarily to be taken as a bad thing. Krishna is not the sole property of some individual group and I am not aware of such claims by iskcon or any other group, although every group maintains their way is the best way, which is an old "tradition".

 

There exist some orthodox temples in India which deny admission to people based on skin color and race. But they are few in number and the general trend is to to allow admission to all. Hinduism has any number of branches and is conceptually different from Semitic religions.

 

If you are confused about what to do, opinions on forums should not be your guide. Go out and do some homework, which will require to look beyond internet sources.

 

Cheers

[bija]

 

"I want to pursue the sense of spiritual growth and satisfaction I feel when I read the Bhagavad Gita and the Upanishads---moving soul-shifting words: ...From his light all these give light, and his radiance illumines all creation..." originally posted by ThusArtThou.

 

Moving and soul shifting words...I think so too. Could you please tell me where this verse comes from?

 

 

 

Bhagavad Gita chapter 10 verse 21: Of the Adyitas I am Visnu, of lights I am the radiant sun, of the Maruts I am Marici, and among the stars I am the moon.

 

Bhagavad Gita chapter 13 verse 18: He is known as the illuminator of even the illuminaries. He is known as the unmanifest, beyond even the darkness. He alone is the fundamental principle of knowledge and the knowable, and He is knowable by the aforementioned practices defined as knowledge. He remains situated within everyone's heart as the Supersoul, Paramatma.

 

Bhagavad Gita Chapter 9(the hidden treasure) verse 2: Know this knowledge as the supreme wisdom and the supreme hidden treasure. It is perfectly pure, and although beyond the purview of sense perception, it is the object of direct perception (by those senses which are eagerly disposed toward devotional service[bhakti]. It is the efficacy of all religion, joyfully accessible, and completely devoid of mundane nature.

 

You shared how you find the words of scripture "moving and soul shifting", this is wonderful! I find chapter nine of the Bhagavad Gita also inspires such sentiments. All the best with your quest.

 

 

 

 

[Sheki]

Well the best one can do is to try and search around till he/she finds where he/she is „at home“.. it is good to read the scriptures and various positions for some years before one is able to build a solid foundation and discrimination in the spiritual field.

In <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">India</st1:place></st1:country-region> there are a lot of traditions and spiritual organizations. Some are more strict when it comes to their dialog with other sects, some are more open. IMHO it was probably better for the sadhana in the times when you could be confined to one path as you would have to be more focused. Unfortunately today with the „global village“ syndrome that is not possible and as a seeker one will have to get in contact with different teachings. Now you can have to positions here. Either (like most of the Gaudya Vaishnavas) consider your path the supreme one (and that's of course logical, otherwise you would not follow it) or consider everything being equal and make a difference of the methods (like bhakti, jnana or raja) more than objects of worship. But than I believe it is good to have the attitude of the Hanuan visiting Krishna story where Krishna had to take the form of Rama for him as it was his Ishta (chosen Ideal) and he did not care for his form as <st1:place w:st="on">Krishna</st1:place>. It is – although you might have respect for all the forms and paths it is still better to be fix on one and focus all the practice on it. I believe that the general opinion of religious <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">India</st1:place></st1:country-region> today goes somewhere along this lines. If you are not jet attracted by a particular path it is good to learn as much as possible about everything. But from the sources, not some syncretistic new-age „gurus“... Well besides Ramakrishna maybe as his syncretism has more of the attitude from the Hanuman story than the superficial new-age ideal. And as his was a rare instance of mystic following different paths even after realizing the goals of his own sadhanas - just to find out what it is about. So The Gospel of Shri Ramakrishnamight be a good place to start as you will find some stories and basics about the different sadhanas and religious groups from a real experience, not just philosophic speculation (You can find it easily on the Amazon.com). It is a big book but I think it is worth reading, for me it was a big source of inspiration at a time. But eventually one has to settle on a specific path and follow the tradition he has chosen.

[Guest guest]

ThusArtThou,

 

From what you described, I suggest studying a branch of Vedanta. Probably Ramanuja's Visistadvaita would be to your satisfaction, since you mentioned the Gita and Upanishads.

 

Guest, thanks for giving ThusArtThou a general introduction to Hinduism. But I just like to comment on some of what you said.

 

 

Most believe in reincarnation, but some don't.

The Rig Veda and the Upanishads are the central texts for Saivism. They Saivites tend to be more heavily immersed in mysticism.

 

I think reincarnation is a central tenent in Hinduism, as all the sects I know of believe in it. Obviously there may be some individuals who are born in a Hindu community but don't follow or know about Hinduism and do not accept reincarnation.

 

As for the Rig Veda it is not the central texts for Shaivism. Shiva as a god isn't even mentioned in the Rig Veda. The central texts of Shaivism are the Shaiva Agamas and the 6 Shaivite Puranas.

 

The Upanishads are the central texts of all sects of Hinduism and are the source of Vedanta which is the spiritual philosophy behind Vaishnavism, Shaivism, Shakta's and Smarta's.

[melvin]

look into your heart.what do you see?nothing!go to a hare krsna temple and what do you see being worshiped? krsna or siva?go to a christian church and see the deities being worshiped.what do see? christ, am i right?it doesn`t realy matter whether it`s krsna or christ we worship provided your heart is pure.it`s only in the heart that one can see rightly.what`s essential is not visible to the eye says the fox in the book the little prince by st. exupery.

[Guest guest]

Dear ThusArtThou:

 

The Supreme Lord dwells in your heart, and the hearts of all beings, as the Paramatma (the Supersoul). You are the temple of the Supreme Lord. Purify your thoughts, let go of your fears, and direct the mind and thoughts inward, and behold the One Being, who permeates all creation, dwelling Inside yourSelf.. Behold the Spiritual Universe within.. there are no 'Isms' there.

 

The Supreme Lord is your eternal Father/Mother/Source, and can be worshipped and experienced anywhere. The whole world is a Temple for His Presence, when we behold it with the spiritual eye. You do not need to feel you have to be a part of the 'right sect' or go to a physical temple before you can meet Him/Her.

 

Yes, we have questions and seek fellowship, but by surrending unto the Supreme Lord, and seeking transcendental Knowledge of your True Self/Nature, you will be led to where you need to be for Satsang (spiritual fellowship and guidance) in this temporal world..

 

Namaste.