Guest guest Posted May 18, 2005 Report Share Posted May 18, 2005 Dear All, Please share your thoughts on today's verse : "When one meditates upon the Guru, he himself becomes the manifestation of Supreme Divinity. He is liberated in pinda (consecrated offering), pada (sacred syllables), and in rupa (form). Of this there is no doubt." Pranams. KaliaDo You ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 this is the key to everything. while it is wrong to assume one's ego as guru, it is also wrong to assume one is beneath or below in the guru at least as potential. jai maa, thou art HER. we become what we dwell upon, this is a universal law. , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati> wrote: > > Dear All, > > > > Please share your thoughts on today's verse : > > > > "When one meditates upon the Guru, he himself becomes the manifestation of Supreme Divinity. He is liberated in pinda (consecrated offering), pada (sacred syllables), and in rupa (form). Of this there is no doubt." > > > > Pranams. > > > > > > Kalia > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 Kalia, This verse appears to complete the arc of verses from 109-119, and begin the focus on the "liberated devotee" (see vs.127), that actually began in vs. 118. This arc of verses, from 109-119 is a really good example of the subtlty and complexity of the author's method of teaching. Each verse is succinct, saying no more than necessary, yet at once building on the previous verse, preparing the way for the next, and even occasionally foreshadowing a new concept a few verses away. The individual concepts are so interwoven, and so logically presented that one can often find new connections and richness of meaning in any given verse a page or two behind or ahead. My impulse is to go through the verses individually and discuss their connections and how they build from one idea to the next, but that would take pages. Instead, look at the first two verses, 109 and 110. We already know this section is generally about the individual soul as Supereme Consciousness, well, 109 begins by explaining what Supreme Consciousness is, then says, It is within us all, "...just as all lights are illuminated by one light." This is the initial summation, the introduction to the concepts to be presented. This is where the author "Tells us what he's gonna tell us." This continues in verse 110, with the reiteration, "...the individual soul is perceived..., and ...the wisdom of one's own soul arises." To this is added a new bit which ties this new concept to all that came before, and continues through to the end, the guru. We are told, it is all due to the guru's grace, "by means of this path of the Guru." Now let's go to the final verse of the series, verse 119, the verse that ties it all together, the verse that "tells us what he told us." This verse says "When one meditates upon the Guru, he himself becomes the manifestation of Supreme Divinity." In between, we are led along a perfect arc describing Supreme Consciousness, Guru as Supreme Consciousness, Supreme Consciousness as a soul, individual soul as Supreme Consciousness, how to perceive the soul, and what the experience of the soul as Supreme Consciousness might feel like. This verse also appears to transition into another section focusing on the experience of "a liberated devotee." The meaning of the terms "pindapada" and "rupa" are given in the text, but what it means to be "liberated in" them is unclear to me. Also unclear is why these particular terms are used. They seem to relate to the performance of puja (yes?). Perhaps they are intended to evoke the image of one's sadhana, the path of the guru, as a gurupuja, in which we receive "the prasad of grace" as liberation in all that we offered, pinda, pada, and rupa, transformed. Anyway, I hope you'll all take a few minutes to contemplate these verses again, with an eye toward their interconnection. There is real beauty in their complex organization. Jai Maa! Chris , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati> wrote: > > Dear All, > > > > Please share your thoughts on today's verse : > > > > "When one meditates upon the Guru, he himself becomes the manifestationof Supreme Divinity. He is liberated in pinda (consecrated offering), pada (sacred syllables), and in rupa (form). Of this there is no doubt." > > > > Pranams. > > > > > > Kalia > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 As usual, your thoughts are well presented and gives much food for thought. I can say nothing further as you have made it very easy to see the inter-connectedness. Thank you. It would really be interesting to see your summary on the verses to this point .... maybe you can consider that over a period of time depending on your availibility and we could put the notes together in one place. Swamiji's Q and A on vs 58 and 114 presented today also took the mind back to vs 68 which says "at His Lotus Feet reside the chief jewel all scriptures". Could the chief jewel be wisdom gained when the energy has risen to the crown which is inturn further illuminated by the Guru? Jai Guru. Kalia Chris Kirner <chriskirner1956 > wrote: Kalia,This verse appears to complete the arc of verses from 109-119, andbegin the focus on the "liberated devotee" (see vs.127), that actuallybegan in vs. 118.This arc of verses, from 109-119 is a really good example of thesubtlty and complexity of the author's method of teaching. Each verseis succinct, saying no more than necessary, yet at once building onthe previous verse, preparing the way for the next, and evenoccasionally foreshadowing a new concept a few verses away. Theindividual concepts are so interwoven, and so logically presented thatone can often find new connections and richness of meaning in anygiven verse a page or two behind or ahead.My impulse is to go through the verses individually and discuss theirconnections and how they build from one idea to the next, but thatwould take pages. Instead, look at the first two verses, 109 and 110. We already know this section is generally about the individual soul asSupereme Consciousness, well, 109 begins by explaining what SupremeConsciousness is, then says, It is within us all, "...just as alllights are illuminated by one light." This is the initial summation,the introduction to the concepts to be presented. This is where theauthor "Tells us what he's gonna tell us." This continues in verse110, with the reiteration, "...the individual soul is perceived...,and ...the wisdom of one's own soul arises." To this is added a newbit which ties this new concept to all that came before, and continuesthrough to the end, the guru. We are told, it is all due to the guru'sgrace, "by means of this path of the Guru."Now let's go to the final verse of the series, verse 119, the versethat ties it all together, the verse that "tells us what he told us."This verse says "When one meditates upon the Guru, he himself becomesthe manifestation of Supreme Divinity."In between, we are led along a perfect arc describing SupremeConsciousness, Guru as Supreme Consciousness, Supreme Consciousness asa soul, individual soul as Supreme Consciousness, how to perceive thesoul, and what the experience of the soul as Supreme Consciousnessmight feel like.This verse also appears to transition into another section focusing onthe experience of "a liberated devotee." The meaning of the terms"pindapada" and "rupa" are given in the text, but what it means tobe "liberated in" them is unclear to me. Also unclear is why theseparticular terms are used. They seem to relate to the performance ofpuja (yes?). Perhaps they are intended to evoke the image of one'ssadhana, the path of the guru, as a gurupuja, in which we receive "theprasad of grace" as liberation in all that we offered, pinda, pada,and rupa, transformed.Anyway, I hope you'll all take a few minutes to contemplate theseverses again, with an eye toward their interconnection. There is realbeauty in their complex organization.Jai Maa!Chris, Kali Kali<kaliananda_saraswati> wrote:> > Dear All,> > > > Please share your thoughts on today's verse :> > > > "When one meditates upon the Guru, he himself becomes themanifestationof Supreme Divinity. He is liberated in pinda(consecrated offering), pada (sacred syllables), and in rupa (form).Of this there is no doubt."> > > > Pranams.> > > > > > Kalia> > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection around > Mail Mobile Take Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2005 Report Share Posted May 20, 2005 Kalia, That is what I think. This whole business of the feet is a little mysterious to me. I'm pretty sure it just means, 'Bind yourself to the Guru, such that you are ever near, that your heart and your mind are prepared and able to hear her every word, catch every drop of wisdom that falls from her mouth, no matter whether you are with her body, or far away. This is the path of the Guru.' I haven't actually counted, but I think that, along with wisdom (knowledge, clarity, etc), the feet of the Guru is likely the most often mentioned concept in the Guru Gita. It is probably the most important. As to my notes, I'm afraid I haven't any (other than a few things scribbled in the margins). During the chatroom I didn't feel like I could contribute much. There just wasn't enough time to think about things, and not really enough time or room to express them. I tend to be kind of deliberate (read slow) in my thinking. Another thing is that in the beginning, I just wasn't familiar enough with the entire text to begin to see things in it. When the class started I began reciting the text every day (of course there was a break of about two months during my little emotional tirade), and I am just now feeling kind of familiar with it. Swamiji may have something to do with that Let me just say how much I appreciate the way you have been commenting on the verses each day. Your perspective is always heartfelt and pure, and often very different than the direction I have been traveling (that's a good thing). I also appreciate your references to other scriptures and sources. : ) Jai Maa! Chris , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati> wrote: > Dear Chris, > > As usual, your thoughts are well presented and gives much food for thought. I can say nothing further as you have made it very easy to see the inter-connectedness. Thank you. > It would really be interesting to see your summary on the verses to this point .... maybe you can consider that over a period of time depending on your availibility and we could put the notes together in one place. > > Swamiji's Q and A on vs 58 and 114 presented today also took the mind back to vs 68 which says "at His Lotus Feet reside the chief jewel all scriptures". Could the chief jewel be wisdom gained when the energy has risen to the crown which is inturn further illuminated by the Guru? > > Jai Guru. > > Kalia > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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