Guest guest Posted May 21, 2005 Report Share Posted May 21, 2005 Oh Giver of Boons, liberation is attained in consecrated offerings. Liberation is attained in the sacred syllables. Liberation is attained in form. Liberation is attained also in that which is beyond form. Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt. Please share your thoughts.Do You ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2005 Report Share Posted May 22, 2005 Kalia, When you read my questions for Swamiji you'll see that I have come to the conclusion that from the perspective of these verses, pinda, pada, and rupa are one. Liberation in one means liberation in all, for they are one cause and one activity. I just hope I got it right... I eagerly await Swamiji's reply (I hope it wasn't too much). Jai Maa! Chris , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati> wrote: > Verse 122 > > Oh Giver of Boons, liberation is attained in consecrated offerings. Liberation is attained in the sacred syllables. Liberation is attained in form. Liberation is attained also in that which is beyond form. Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt. > > Please share your thoughts. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2005 Report Share Posted May 22, 2005 Kaliaji and all, the words 'without a doubt' led to this question: if the one who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt, does that mean that liberation in consecrated offerings, sacred syllables and forms is still not quite secure? I've heard it said that those who climb high can fall down very low. I also understand that one 'break-through' or experience of samadhi does not mean final liberation. So, does this mean that one is liberated only when firmly established in the perfection of union (nirvikalpa samadhi), and that even one who has experiences savikalpa samadhi can remain attached to the reflection of Self and not be liberated? Perhaps I'm reading too much into this. What do you think? with love, Henny In , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati> wrote: > Verse 122 > > Oh Giver of Boons, liberation is attained in consecrated offerings. Liberation is attained in the sacred syllables. Liberation is attained in form. Liberation is attained also in that which is beyond form. Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt. > > Please share your thoughts. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2005 Report Share Posted May 22, 2005 Yes, this is what the verse seems to say, the goal is liberation the method or path is the means to liberation. I too await Swamiji's response. KaliaChris Kirner <chriskirner1956 > wrote: Kalia,When you read my questions for Swamiji you'll see that I have come tothe conclusion that from the perspective of these verses, pinda, pada,and rupa are one. Liberation in one means liberation in all, for theyare one cause and one activity. I just hope I got it right...I eagerly await Swamiji's reply (I hope it wasn't too much).Jai Maa!Chris, Kali Kali<kaliananda_saraswati> wrote:> Verse 122> > Oh Giver of Boons, liberation is attained in consecrated offerings.Liberation is attained in the sacred syllables. Liberation isattained in form. Liberation is attained also in that which is beyondform. Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated withouta doubt.> > Please share your thoughts.> > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection around > Mail - You care about security. So do we. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2005 Report Share Posted May 22, 2005 Henny, No (or is it yes) samadhi does not mean final liberation. Bhaava samadhi is kind of getting lost in a bhaava; it has no lasting effects after it has passed (to my knowledge). The samprajnata samadhis (those with knowledge) have many lasting effects, and do "perfect" a person, but they must be replied regularly or the personal tendencies will begin to resurface. Asamprajnata samadhi, samadhi without knowledge, is liberation, but this is well beyond my experience or knowledge. Jai Maa! Chris , "henny_v_i" <HvI@S...> wrote: > Kaliaji and all, > > the words 'without a doubt' led to this question: if the one who > resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt, > does that mean that liberation in consecrated offerings, sacred > syllables and forms is still not quite secure? I've heard it said that > those who climb high can fall down very low. I also understand that > one 'break-through' or experience of samadhi does not mean final > liberation. So, does this mean that one is liberated only when firmly > established in the perfection of union (nirvikalpa samadhi), and that > even one who has experiences savikalpa samadhi can remain attached to > the reflection of Self and not be liberated? Perhaps I'm reading too > much into this. What do you think? > > with love, > Henny > > In , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati> > wrote: > > Verse 122 > > > > Oh Giver of Boons, liberation is attained in consecrated offerings. > Liberation is attained in the sacred syllables. Liberation is > attained in form. Liberation is attained also in that which is beyond > form. Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without > a doubt. > > > > Please share your thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2005 Report Share Posted May 23, 2005 , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati> wrote: > Verse 122 > > Oh Giver of Boons, liberation is attained in consecrated offerings. Liberation is attained in the sacred syllables. Liberation is attained in form. Liberation is attained also in that which is beyond form. Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt. > > Please share your thoughts. ====== Dearest Family- I read this verse with the understanding of what the offerings, syllables, form, and beyond form, are (as explained in verse 121) and that liberation is to be found in each of these. The final line "Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt" reminds me of initiation I have had to various forms of meditation that take one into samadhi. The highest uses a method of focus "without form". I understand verse 122 to express both a path, and a promise that those who reside in the Supreme Divinity, which is without end (verse 117), will achieve liberation without a doubt. It expresses a path and a promise to me. Om Sanga Shanti Shanti Shanti. -S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2005 Report Share Posted May 23, 2005 It seems like the language used in the Guru Gita uses the phrase "without a doubt" as in: The one who resides in the liberation beyond form is DEFINATELY liberated. "Without a doubt" is used in several other texts the same way, and I think this is what they mean by the translation. In other words, "without a doubt" = "definately" I'm not positive about this, maybe Swami Ji can say.? henny_v_i <HvI (AT) SoftHome (DOT) net> wrote: Kaliaji and all,the words 'without a doubt' led to this question: if the one who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt, does that mean that liberation in consecrated offerings, sacred syllables and forms is still not quite secure? I've heard it said that those who climb high can fall down very low. I also understand that one 'break-through' or experience of samadhi does not mean final liberation. So, does this mean that one is liberated only when firmly established in the perfection of union (nirvikalpa samadhi), and that even one who has experiences savikalpa samadhi can remain attached to the reflection of Self and not be liberated? Perhaps I'm reading too much into this. What do you think?with love,HennyIn , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati> wrote:> Verse 122> > Oh Giver of Boons, liberation is attained in consecrated offerings. Liberation is attained in the sacred syllables. Liberation is attained in form. Liberation is attained also in that which is beyond form. Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt.> > Please share your thoughts.> > > Do You ?> Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection around > Do You ?Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2005 Report Share Posted May 24, 2005 Namaste Nirmilandandaji, thank you for your response. The more you think about a phrase, the more different meanings it seems to acquire, and also sometimes I'm not sure about the exact shade of meaning in English, with love, Henny , Nirmalananda Saraswati <nirmalananda1008> wrote: > Namaste Henny, > > It seems like the language used in the Guru Gita uses the phrase "without a doubt" as in: The one who > resides in the liberation beyond form is DEFINATELY liberated. "Without a doubt" is used in several other texts the same way, and I think this is what they mean by the translation. In other words, "without a doubt" = "definately" > > I'm not positive about this, maybe Swami Ji can say.? > > > > henny_v_i <HvI@S...> wrote: > Kaliaji and all, > > the words 'without a doubt' led to this question: if the one who > resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without a doubt, > does that mean that liberation in consecrated offerings, sacred > syllables and forms is still not quite secure? I've heard it said that > those who climb high can fall down very low. I also understand that > one 'break-through' or experience of samadhi does not mean final > liberation. So, does this mean that one is liberated only when firmly > established in the perfection of union (nirvikalpa samadhi), and that > even one who has experiences savikalpa samadhi can remain attached to > the reflection of Self and not be liberated? Perhaps I'm reading too > much into this. What do you think? > > with love, > Henny > > In , Kali Kali <kaliananda_saraswati > > wrote: > > Verse 122 > > > > Oh Giver of Boons, liberation is attained in consecrated offerings. > Liberation is attained in the sacred syllables. Liberation is > attained in form. Liberation is attained also in that which is beyond > form. Who resides in the liberation beyond form is liberated without > a doubt. > > > > Please share your thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > / > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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