Guest guest Posted August 21, 2005 Report Share Posted August 21, 2005 Day 9: Q/A feedback Namaste to all, Henny asked the following questions: 1.I realize there are many levels of interpretation, but the mantras we learned concerning the seat (om kushasane..) and these new mantras for purification all refer in some way to the aspect of the Divine named Vishnu. I have wondered why; is it because Vishnu, or the All Pervading Consciousness, is stable (no waves or fluctuations to trouble the waters) and supporting (so we remain firm in our attention)? A: Swamiji says that Vishnu and Shiva are one. I like your interpretation that we remain firm in our attention because that is how Swamiji defines worship. Worship means to pay attention and we want to pay attention to every moment, every action. With attention every action we perform becomes a worship, a puja. Please look in the Bhagavad Gita as there are many references to purity as spoken by the Supreme Divinity(Krishna) to the Clarity of Devotion(Arjuna.) 2.Q:You asked us to pay special attention to the mantra beginning with:'om apavitrah...). As I understand it, this means that our minds interpret what we see as either pure or impure. If we look with divine eyes, there is no impurity to be seen. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, or 'to see God you must become God', or 'in Thy light I see Light'. Shree Ramakrishna saw no difference between what others considered pure or impure. Which brings me to the following question: why do we have to purify our hands after having touched the mouth? Is the mouth considered to be impure? Why (especially since we have already purified the mouth by rinsing it with Consciousness)? A: Thanks for bringing up these questions. We have often had discussions about this topic around here. First and foremost we want remember to strive for an attitude of the highest respect. Swamiji says that our focus must be on the goal to make every offering convey the sincerity of our love and devotion to God. Everything we serve and offer must be offered to God first. There are certain rules of purity which are designed for this purpose. By following these rules of purity it demonstrates our conscious longing to guide our awareness into the presence of divinity. By not following these rules of purity like "aachamana" we create what is known in Sanskrit as "jutha," defiled or impure. Offerings that are jutha are no longer suitable to be offered as an offering of respect to God, and should not even be accepted by devotees. We want to take prasad(sanctified offering) from God. We do not want to give God our prasad. When we purify our mouth in the puja we are purifying our mouth so we may speak words of consciousness, not the gross level. If we touch our hand to our mouth after that then we will have made our hand jutha and everything we touch will be jutha as well and this will be considered giving God our prasad. Therefore after our hand touches our mouth we need to clean it off, too. Remember it is the conscious effort of our longing for that highest station that is the offering. 3. Q: If something falls on the floor, why should it have become impure? Is the floor impure? Why? If Consciousness pervades all, how can anything be unpure or unfit to be offered to God? A: There are also certain rules of purity we follow when we cook as well. In a similar way we do not taste the food before we offer it to God because that would be like giving God our prasad. Here is one example that came to mind on this topic: If I cook something for Shree Maa and a piece of food falls on the floor I will not put that food back on the plate and offer it to her even though the mantra says the pure and the impure reside together. Why? The mantra says: "apavitrah pavitro vaa..." Yes, God does exist in the floor but still I want to convey to Maa the highest respect and purity. I would not give Maa some food that had fallen on the floor and then tell her that it is okay to eat this food because God also dwells in the floor. I think we need to have some discrimination. This is the same reason we do not offer to Agni the rice that has fallen on the floor. On the other hand there have been times when Maa has accepted jutha offerings because "apavitrah pavitro vaa...." Remember that following these rules of purity help us to consciously convey our sincere longing to become one with the Highest Divinity and we will strive to convey this attitude of respect with every action and towards everyone we meet. Henny, don't worry, if you come over to dinner I will not offer you some food that has fallen on the floor either.(lol) By the way, what is your favorite food to eat? 4. What does the term 'twice-born' mean in the mantra beginning 'om tad vipra pipanova'? Does it refer to the state of the performer of the puja? Who realizes that he/she is not the performer at all? A: The twice born refers to the Brahmins who are born once from the earthly womb and once from the womb of wisdom. In this particular mantra we are addressing Vishnu who dwells in the highest station of the Brahmin who is performing this puja. Surya asked Swamiji these questions about Shiva puja: 1. I was just curious is this way of performing Shiva Puja unique to this lineage or is this the way it is done in many lineages? A: Many lineages. 2. Also I just heard some various Vedic mantras chanted in "Ghanam" style and was blown away by it. Since I remember hearing that Swamiji could chant the entire Durga Saptashati forwards and backwards, I was just wondering if he had ever heard anyone chant the Sri Rudram and/or the Durga Saptashati in this style? A: Yes. It is different from the pranayam styles which we employ, and it is used for a different reason. Q: Kalachandra asked: "You will already have a small container of water set up on your altar. You will use this water for aachamana. It has not been purified yet but we will get to this soon. " Is this the same countainer I will use in the Om gange ....Is necessary another countener? A: Yes. It is the same container for Om gange..... You do not need another container. Om Namah Shivaaya! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2005 Report Share Posted August 21, 2005 thank you Parvati for your helpful comments on ceremonial purity during worship. Sri Ramakrishna did the worship for many years in the Kali Temple, and during that time he scrupulously observed the Hindu rules of purity in connection with the worship. He also considered ganges water greatly and literally purifying. For example, when someone put a newspaper down in His room, after the newspaper was removed, He would ask His attendant to sprinkle ganges water in the spot where the newspaper was. If some impure person came to see Him, He would also sprinkle ganges water in the spot where that person sat. After practicing worship for many years, Ramakrishna reached a point where He saw everything as the Divine Mother, and He was even offering food to a cat at which point the Brahmin priests felt scandalized. They at once called the Brahmani, who sent Mathur Babu to investigate. Mathur came and watched Ramakrishna's worship from a distance. Afterwards, Mathur told the Brahmin priests to let Ramakrishna worhsip as He pleased since he saw the Mother in everything. He was in a high state. >From examples like these in the lives of great souls, I have understood that purity can be a matter of convention or etiquette or, as in the life of Ramakrishna, it is often a matter of direct perception. My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained. Jai Maa! Kumari , "parv108" <parv108> wrote: > Day 9: Q/A feedback > > Namaste to all, > > Henny asked the following questions: > > 1.I realize there are many levels of interpretation, but the mantras > we learned concerning the seat (om kushasane..) and these > new mantras for purification all refer in some way to the aspect > of the Divine named > Vishnu. I have wondered why; is it because Vishnu, or the All > Pervading Consciousness, is stable (no waves or fluctuations to > trouble the waters) and supporting (so we remain firm in our > attention)? > > A: Swamiji says that Vishnu and Shiva are one. > > I like your interpretation that we remain firm in our attention > because that is how Swamiji defines worship. Worship means > to pay attention and we want to pay attention to every moment, > every action. With attention every action we perform becomes a > worship, a puja. > > Please look in the Bhagavad Gita as there are many references > to purity as spoken by the Supreme Divinity(Krishna) to the > Clarity of Devotion(Arjuna.) > > > 2.Q:You asked us to pay special attention to the mantra > beginning with:'om apavitrah...). As I understand it, this means > that our minds interpret what we see as either pure or impure. If > we look with divine eyes, there is no impurity to be seen. Beauty > is in the eye of the beholder, or 'to see God you must become > God', or 'in Thy light I see Light'. Shree Ramakrishna saw no > difference between what others > considered pure or impure. > > Which brings me to the following question: why do we have to > purify our hands after having touched the mouth? Is the mouth > considered to be impure? Why (especially since we have already > purified the mouth by rinsing it with Consciousness)? > > A: Thanks for bringing up these questions. > > We have often had discussions about this topic around here. > First and foremost we want remember to strive for an attitude of > the highest respect. Swamiji says that our focus must be on the > goal to make every offering convey the sincerity of our love and > devotion to God. Everything we serve and offer must be offered to God first. There are certain rules of purity which are > designed for this purpose. By following these rules of purity it > demonstrates our conscious longing to guide our awareness > into the presence of divinity. > > By not following these rules of purity like "aachamana" we create > what is known in Sanskrit as "jutha," defiled or impure. Offerings > that are jutha are no longer suitable to be offered as an offering > of respect to God, and should not even be accepted by devotees. We want to take prasad(sanctified offering) from God. We do not want to give God our prasad. > > When we purify our mouth in the > puja we are purifying our mouth so we may speak words of > consciousness, not the gross level. If we touch our hand to our > mouth after that then we will have made our hand jutha and > everything we touch will be jutha as well and this will be > considered giving God our prasad. Therefore after our hand > touches our mouth we need to clean it off, too. > > Remember it is the conscious effort of our longing for that > highest station that is the offering. > > 3. Q: If something falls on the floor, why should it have become > impure? Is the floor impure? Why? If Consciousness pervades > all, how can anything be unpure or unfit to be offered to God? > > A: There are also certain rules of purity we follow when we cook > as well. In a similar way we do not taste the food before we offer > it to God because that would be like giving God our prasad. > > Here is one example that came to mind on this topic: If I cook > something for Shree Maa and a piece of food falls on the floor I > will not put that food back on the plate and offer it to her even > though the mantra says the pure and the impure reside together. > Why? The mantra says: "apavitrah pavitro vaa..." Yes, God does > exist in the floor but still I want to convey to Maa the highest > respect and purity. I would not give Maa some food that had > fallen on the floor and then tell her that it is okay to eat this food > because God also dwells in the floor. I think we need to have some discrimination. This is the same reason we do not offer to Agni the rice that has fallen on the floor. > > On the other hand there have been times when Maa has > accepted jutha offerings because "apavitrah pavitro vaa...." > > Remember that following these rules of purity help us to > consciously convey our sincere longing to become one with the > Highest Divinity and we will strive to convey this attitude of > respect with every action and towards everyone we meet. Henny, > don't worry, if you come over to dinner I will not offer you some > food that has fallen on the floor either.(lol) By the way, what is > your favorite food to eat? > > 4. What does the term 'twice-born' mean in the mantra beginning > 'om tad vipra pipanova'? Does it refer to the state of the > performer of the puja? Who realizes that he/she is not the > performer at all? > > A: The twice born refers to the Brahmins who are born once from > the earthly womb and once from the womb of wisdom. > In this particular mantra we are addressing Vishnu who dwells > in the highest station of the Brahmin who is performing this puja. > > > Surya asked Swamiji these questions about Shiva puja: > > 1. I was just curious is this way of performing Shiva Puja unique > to this lineage or is this the way it is done in many lineages? > > A: Many lineages. > > 2. Also I just heard some various Vedic mantras chanted in > "Ghanam" style and was blown away by it. Since I remember > hearing that Swamiji could chant the entire Durga Saptashati > forwards and backwards, I was just wondering if he had ever > heard anyone chant the Sri Rudram and/or the Durga Saptashati > in this style? > > A: Yes. It is different from the pranayam styles which we employ, > and it is used for a different reason. > > > Q: Kalachandra asked: > "You will already have a small container of water > set up on your altar. You will use this water for aachamana. It > has not been purified yet but we will get to this soon. " Is this the > same countainer I will use in the Om gange ....Is necessary > another countener? > > A: Yes. It is the same container for Om gange..... > You do not need another container. > > Om Namah Shivaaya! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2005 Report Share Posted August 21, 2005 , "ty_maa" <ds.james@c...> wrote: > "My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained." Jai Maa, Kumariji! Very beautifully and wisely said! i bow to you! Jai Shree Maa! Jai Swamiji! Jai Thakur Ramakrishna Deva! your sister dissolving in Maa's Love, muktimaa thank you Parvati for your helpful comments on ceremonial purity > during worship. > > Sri Ramakrishna did the worship for many years in the Kali Temple, and > during that time he scrupulously observed the Hindu rules of purity in > connection with the worship. > > He also considered ganges water greatly and literally purifying. > For example, when someone put a newspaper down in His room, after the > newspaper was removed, He would ask His attendant to sprinkle ganges > water in the spot where the newspaper was. If some impure person came > to see Him, He would also sprinkle ganges water in the spot where that > person sat. > > After practicing worship for many years, Ramakrishna reached a point > where He saw everything as the Divine Mother, and He was even offering > food to a cat at which point the Brahmin priests felt scandalized. > They at once called the Brahmani, who sent Mathur Babu to investigate. > Mathur came and watched Ramakrishna's worship from a distance. > Afterwards, Mathur told the Brahmin priests to let Ramakrishna worhsip > as He pleased since he saw the Mother in everything. He was in a high > state. > > From examples like these in the lives of great souls, I have > understood that purity can be a matter of convention or etiquette or, > as in the life of Ramakrishna, it is often a matter of direct perception. > > My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions > of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they > will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained. > > > Jai Maa! > Kumari > > > > > , "parv108" <parv108> wrote: > > Day 9: Q/A feedback > > > > Namaste to all, > > > > Henny asked the following questions: > > > > 1.I realize there are many levels of interpretation, but the mantras > > we learned concerning the seat (om kushasane..) and these > > new mantras for purification all refer in some way to the aspect > > of the Divine named > > Vishnu. I have wondered why; is it because Vishnu, or the All > > Pervading Consciousness, is stable (no waves or fluctuations to > > trouble the waters) and supporting (so we remain firm in our > > attention)? > > > > A: Swamiji says that Vishnu and Shiva are one. > > > > I like your interpretation that we remain firm in our attention > > because that is how Swamiji defines worship. Worship means > > to pay attention and we want to pay attention to every moment, > > every action. With attention every action we perform becomes a > > worship, a puja. > > > > Please look in the Bhagavad Gita as there are many references > > to purity as spoken by the Supreme Divinity(Krishna) to the > > Clarity of Devotion(Arjuna.) > > > > > > 2.Q:You asked us to pay special attention to the mantra > > beginning with:'om apavitrah...). As I understand it, this means > > that our minds interpret what we see as either pure or impure. If > > we look with divine eyes, there is no impurity to be seen. Beauty > > is in the eye of the beholder, or 'to see God you must become > > God', or 'in Thy light I see Light'. Shree Ramakrishna saw no > > difference between what others > > considered pure or impure. > > > > Which brings me to the following question: why do we have to > > purify our hands after having touched the mouth? Is the mouth > > considered to be impure? Why (especially since we have already > > purified the mouth by rinsing it with Consciousness)? > > > > A: Thanks for bringing up these questions. > > > > We have often had discussions about this topic around here. > > First and foremost we want remember to strive for an attitude of > > the highest respect. Swamiji says that our focus must be on the > > goal to make every offering convey the sincerity of our love and > > devotion to God. Everything we serve and offer must be offered to > God first. There are certain rules of purity which are > > designed for this purpose. By following these rules of purity it > > demonstrates our conscious longing to guide our awareness > > into the presence of divinity. > > > > By not following these rules of purity like "aachamana" we create > > what is known in Sanskrit as "jutha," defiled or impure. Offerings > > that are jutha are no longer suitable to be offered as an offering > > of respect to God, and should not even be accepted by devotees. We > want to take prasad(sanctified offering) from God. We do not want to > give God our prasad. > > > > When we purify our mouth in the > > puja we are purifying our mouth so we may speak words of > > consciousness, not the gross level. If we touch our hand to our > > mouth after that then we will have made our hand jutha and > > everything we touch will be jutha as well and this will be > > considered giving God our prasad. Therefore after our hand > > touches our mouth we need to clean it off, too. > > > > Remember it is the conscious effort of our longing for that > > highest station that is the offering. > > > > 3. Q: If something falls on the floor, why should it have become > > impure? Is the floor impure? Why? If Consciousness pervades > > all, how can anything be unpure or unfit to be offered to God? > > > > A: There are also certain rules of purity we follow when we cook > > as well. In a similar way we do not taste the food before we offer > > it to God because that would be like giving God our prasad. > > > > Here is one example that came to mind on this topic: If I cook > > something for Shree Maa and a piece of food falls on the floor I > > will not put that food back on the plate and offer it to her even > > though the mantra says the pure and the impure reside together. > > Why? The mantra says: "apavitrah pavitro vaa..." Yes, God does > > exist in the floor but still I want to convey to Maa the highest > > respect and purity. I would not give Maa some food that had > > fallen on the floor and then tell her that it is okay to eat this food > > because God also dwells in the floor. I think we need to have some > discrimination. This is the same reason we do not offer to Agni the > rice that has fallen on the floor. > > > > On the other hand there have been times when Maa has > > accepted jutha offerings because "apavitrah pavitro vaa...." > > > > Remember that following these rules of purity help us to > > consciously convey our sincere longing to become one with the > > Highest Divinity and we will strive to convey this attitude of > > respect with every action and towards everyone we meet. Henny, > > don't worry, if you come over to dinner I will not offer you some > > food that has fallen on the floor either.(lol) By the way, what is > > your favorite food to eat? > > > > 4. What does the term 'twice-born' mean in the mantra beginning > > 'om tad vipra pipanova'? Does it refer to the state of the > > performer of the puja? Who realizes that he/she is not the > > performer at all? > > > > A: The twice born refers to the Brahmins who are born once from > > the earthly womb and once from the womb of wisdom. > > In this particular mantra we are addressing Vishnu who dwells > > in the highest station of the Brahmin who is performing this puja. > > > > > > Surya asked Swamiji these questions about Shiva puja: > > > > 1. I was just curious is this way of performing Shiva Puja unique > > to this lineage or is this the way it is done in many lineages? > > > > A: Many lineages. > > > > 2. Also I just heard some various Vedic mantras chanted in > > "Ghanam" style and was blown away by it. Since I remember > > hearing that Swamiji could chant the entire Durga Saptashati > > forwards and backwards, I was just wondering if he had ever > > heard anyone chant the Sri Rudram and/or the Durga Saptashati > > in this style? > > > > A: Yes. It is different from the pranayam styles which we employ, > > and it is used for a different reason. > > > > > > Q: Kalachandra asked: > > "You will already have a small container of water > > set up on your altar. You will use this water for aachamana. It > > has not been purified yet but we will get to this soon. " Is this the > > same countainer I will use in the Om gange ....Is necessary > > another countener? > > > > A: Yes. It is the same container for Om gange..... > > You do not need another container. > > > > Om Namah Shivaaya! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 22, 2005 Report Share Posted August 22, 2005 Namaste Parvatiji, thank you very much for taking the time to answer all my questions. you said: "There are certain rules of purity which are > designed for this purpose. By following these rules of purity it > demonstrates our conscious longing to guide our awareness > into the presence of divinity." Sometimes you have to ask a question because you just need to hear the answer, even though in your heart you know already. "To guide our awareness into the presence of divinity"; this is so beautifully said. I do understand the purpose of these rules and, thanks to your kind explanation, I can now also see the beauty and grace in these conscious demonstrations of our sincere intentions and longing. So I'll joyfully continue my efforts to learn the rules and follow them. > Remember that following these rules of purity help us to > consciously convey our sincere longing to become one with the > Highest Divinity and we will strive to convey this attitude of > respect with every action and towards everyone we meet. Yes, I am beginning to see how 'ritual puja' in front of our altar is connected with worship in a much larger sense. Beautiful! > Henny, > don't worry, if you come over to dinner I will not offer you some > food that has fallen on the floor either.(lol) By the way, what is > your favorite food to eat? Lol, that's ok then. As far as favorites are concerned, that's a bit like asking me what my favorite devotional poem is... but my absolute favorite is a combination of rice,tofu fried with soy-sauce and mixed vegetables:). Parvatiji, this 'enhancing our Shiva puja' means much more than adding some new mantra's to our practice; it enhances our entire lives. Thank you for guiding us. I bow to our Glorious Teachers, with love Henny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 22, 2005 Report Share Posted August 22, 2005 Namaste Kumari, > From examples like these in the lives of great souls, I have > understood that purity can be a matter of convention or etiquette or, > as in the life of Ramakrishna, it is often a matter of direct perception. > > My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions > of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they > will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained. Well said, I agree with you. I just wanted to say: I hope you'll understand that I did not mean to imply in my question that what was appropriate for Shri Ramakrishna should be appropriate for me. I mentioned His name because I wanted to make the point that the pure see purity everywhere and His was the best example that came to mind. The questions that followed were asked because I needed to hear the purpose of the rules (again), not to criticize their existence. with love, Henny -- In , "ty_maa" <ds.james@c...> wrote: > thank you Parvati for your helpful comments on ceremonial purity > during worship. > > Sri Ramakrishna did the worship for many years in the Kali Temple, and > during that time he scrupulously observed the Hindu rules of purity in > connection with the worship. > > He also considered ganges water greatly and literally purifying. > For example, when someone put a newspaper down in His room, after the > newspaper was removed, He would ask His attendant to sprinkle ganges > water in the spot where the newspaper was. If some impure person came > to see Him, He would also sprinkle ganges water in the spot where that > person sat. > > After practicing worship for many years, Ramakrishna reached a point > where He saw everything as the Divine Mother, and He was even offering > food to a cat at which point the Brahmin priests felt scandalized. > They at once called the Brahmani, who sent Mathur Babu to investigate. > Mathur came and watched Ramakrishna's worship from a distance. > Afterwards, Mathur told the Brahmin priests to let Ramakrishna worhsip > as He pleased since he saw the Mother in everything. He was in a high > state. > > From examples like these in the lives of great souls, I have > understood that purity can be a matter of convention or etiquette or, > as in the life of Ramakrishna, it is often a matter of direct perception. > > My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions > of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they > will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained. > > > Jai Maa! > Kumari > > > > > , "parv108" <parv108> wrote: > > Day 9: Q/A feedback > > > > Namaste to all, > > > > Henny asked the following questions: > > > > 1.I realize there are many levels of interpretation, but the mantras > > we learned concerning the seat (om kushasane..) and these > > new mantras for purification all refer in some way to the aspect > > of the Divine named > > Vishnu. I have wondered why; is it because Vishnu, or the All > > Pervading Consciousness, is stable (no waves or fluctuations to > > trouble the waters) and supporting (so we remain firm in our > > attention)? > > > > A: Swamiji says that Vishnu and Shiva are one. > > > > I like your interpretation that we remain firm in our attention > > because that is how Swamiji defines worship. Worship means > > to pay attention and we want to pay attention to every moment, > > every action. With attention every action we perform becomes a > > worship, a puja. > > > > Please look in the Bhagavad Gita as there are many references > > to purity as spoken by the Supreme Divinity(Krishna) to the > > Clarity of Devotion(Arjuna.) > > > > > > 2.Q:You asked us to pay special attention to the mantra > > beginning with:'om apavitrah...). As I understand it, this means > > that our minds interpret what we see as either pure or impure. If > > we look with divine eyes, there is no impurity to be seen. Beauty > > is in the eye of the beholder, or 'to see God you must become > > God', or 'in Thy light I see Light'. Shree Ramakrishna saw no > > difference between what others > > considered pure or impure. > > > > Which brings me to the following question: why do we have to > > purify our hands after having touched the mouth? Is the mouth > > considered to be impure? Why (especially since we have already > > purified the mouth by rinsing it with Consciousness)? > > > > A: Thanks for bringing up these questions. > > > > We have often had discussions about this topic around here. > > First and foremost we want remember to strive for an attitude of > > the highest respect. Swamiji says that our focus must be on the > > goal to make every offering convey the sincerity of our love and > > devotion to God. Everything we serve and offer must be offered to > God first. There are certain rules of purity which are > > designed for this purpose. By following these rules of purity it > > demonstrates our conscious longing to guide our awareness > > into the presence of divinity. > > > > By not following these rules of purity like "aachamana" we create > > what is known in Sanskrit as "jutha," defiled or impure. Offerings > > that are jutha are no longer suitable to be offered as an offering > > of respect to God, and should not even be accepted by devotees. We > want to take prasad(sanctified offering) from God. We do not want to > give God our prasad. > > > > When we purify our mouth in the > > puja we are purifying our mouth so we may speak words of > > consciousness, not the gross level. If we touch our hand to our > > mouth after that then we will have made our hand jutha and > > everything we touch will be jutha as well and this will be > > considered giving God our prasad. Therefore after our hand > > touches our mouth we need to clean it off, too. > > > > Remember it is the conscious effort of our longing for that > > highest station that is the offering. > > > > 3. Q: If something falls on the floor, why should it have become > > impure? Is the floor impure? Why? If Consciousness pervades > > all, how can anything be unpure or unfit to be offered to God? > > > > A: There are also certain rules of purity we follow when we cook > > as well. In a similar way we do not taste the food before we offer > > it to God because that would be like giving God our prasad. > > > > Here is one example that came to mind on this topic: If I cook > > something for Shree Maa and a piece of food falls on the floor I > > will not put that food back on the plate and offer it to her even > > though the mantra says the pure and the impure reside together. > > Why? The mantra says: "apavitrah pavitro vaa..." Yes, God does > > exist in the floor but still I want to convey to Maa the highest > > respect and purity. I would not give Maa some food that had > > fallen on the floor and then tell her that it is okay to eat this food > > because God also dwells in the floor. I think we need to have some > discrimination. This is the same reason we do not offer to Agni the > rice that has fallen on the floor. > > > > On the other hand there have been times when Maa has > > accepted jutha offerings because "apavitrah pavitro vaa...." > > > > Remember that following these rules of purity help us to > > consciously convey our sincere longing to become one with the > > Highest Divinity and we will strive to convey this attitude of > > respect with every action and towards everyone we meet. Henny, > > don't worry, if you come over to dinner I will not offer you some > > food that has fallen on the floor either.(lol) By the way, what is > > your favorite food to eat? > > > > 4. What does the term 'twice-born' mean in the mantra beginning > > 'om tad vipra pipanova'? Does it refer to the state of the > > performer of the puja? Who realizes that he/she is not the > > performer at all? > > > > A: The twice born refers to the Brahmins who are born once from > > the earthly womb and once from the womb of wisdom. > > In this particular mantra we are addressing Vishnu who dwells > > in the highest station of the Brahmin who is performing this puja. > > > > > > Surya asked Swamiji these questions about Shiva puja: > > > > 1. I was just curious is this way of performing Shiva Puja unique > > to this lineage or is this the way it is done in many lineages? > > > > A: Many lineages. > > > > 2. Also I just heard some various Vedic mantras chanted in > > "Ghanam" style and was blown away by it. Since I remember > > hearing that Swamiji could chant the entire Durga Saptashati > > forwards and backwards, I was just wondering if he had ever > > heard anyone chant the Sri Rudram and/or the Durga Saptashati > > in this style? > > > > A: Yes. It is different from the pranayam styles which we employ, > > and it is used for a different reason. > > > > > > Q: Kalachandra asked: > > "You will already have a small container of water > > set up on your altar. You will use this water for aachamana. It > > has not been purified yet but we will get to this soon. " Is this the > > same countainer I will use in the Om gange ....Is necessary > > another countener? > > > > A: Yes. It is the same container for Om gange..... > > You do not need another container. > > > > Om Namah Shivaaya! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Dear Henny, I very much appreciated your questions on purity and impurity. as Parvati mentioned, the topic comes up for discussion often. I know I also need to hear these things again and again. finally, it all sinks in and becomes our nature. in my opinion, your example of Sri Ramakrishna was exact and well stated. what better example could one use! I felt blessed to have received such a practical response about ritual purity, and with a precious example from Maa's life. thank you for opening that discussion. this is what holy company and satsangha is all about. With Love, Kumari , "henny_v_i" <HvI@S...> wrote: > Namaste Kumari, > > > From examples like these in the lives of great souls, I have > > understood that purity can be a matter of convention or etiquette > or, > > as in the life of Ramakrishna, it is often a matter of direct > perception. > > > > My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions > > of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they > > will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained. > > Well said, I agree with you. I just wanted to say: I hope you'll > understand that I did not mean to imply in my question that what was > appropriate for Shri Ramakrishna should be appropriate for me. I > mentioned His name because I wanted to make the point that the pure > see purity everywhere and His was the best example that came to mind. > The questions that followed were asked because I needed to hear the > purpose of the rules (again), not to criticize their existence. > > with love, > Henny > > > -- In , "ty_maa" <ds.james@c...> wrote: > > thank you Parvati for your helpful comments on ceremonial purity > > during worship. > > > > Sri Ramakrishna did the worship for many years in the Kali Temple, > and > > during that time he scrupulously observed the Hindu rules of purity > in > > connection with the worship. > > > > He also considered ganges water greatly and literally purifying. > > For example, when someone put a newspaper down in His room, after > the > > newspaper was removed, He would ask His attendant to sprinkle ganges > > water in the spot where the newspaper was. If some impure person > came > > to see Him, He would also sprinkle ganges water in the spot where > that > > person sat. > > > > After practicing worship for many years, Ramakrishna reached a point > > where He saw everything as the Divine Mother, and He was even > offering > > food to a cat at which point the Brahmin priests felt scandalized. > > They at once called the Brahmani, who sent Mathur Babu to > investigate. > > Mathur came and watched Ramakrishna's worship from a distance. > > Afterwards, Mathur told the Brahmin priests to let Ramakrishna > worhsip > > as He pleased since he saw the Mother in everything. He was in a > high > > state. > > > > From examples like these in the lives of great souls, I have > > understood that purity can be a matter of convention or etiquette > or, > > as in the life of Ramakrishna, it is often a matter of direct > perception. > > > > My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions > > of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they > > will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained. > > > > > > Jai Maa! > > Kumari > > > > > > > > > > , "parv108" <parv108> wrote: > > > Day 9: Q/A feedback > > > > > > Namaste to all, > > > > > > Henny asked the following questions: > > > > > > 1.I realize there are many levels of interpretation, but the > mantras > > > we learned concerning the seat (om kushasane..) and these > > > new mantras for purification all refer in some way to the aspect > > > of the Divine named > > > Vishnu. I have wondered why; is it because Vishnu, or the All > > > Pervading Consciousness, is stable (no waves or fluctuations to > > > trouble the waters) and supporting (so we remain firm in our > > > attention)? > > > > > > A: Swamiji says that Vishnu and Shiva are one. > > > > > > I like your interpretation that we remain firm in our attention > > > because that is how Swamiji defines worship. Worship means > > > to pay attention and we want to pay attention to every moment, > > > every action. With attention every action we perform becomes a > > > worship, a puja. > > > > > > Please look in the Bhagavad Gita as there are many references > > > to purity as spoken by the Supreme Divinity(Krishna) to the > > > Clarity of Devotion(Arjuna.) > > > > > > > > > 2.Q:You asked us to pay special attention to the mantra > > > beginning with:'om apavitrah...). As I understand it, this means > > > that our minds interpret what we see as either pure or impure. If > > > we look with divine eyes, there is no impurity to be seen. Beauty > > > is in the eye of the beholder, or 'to see God you must become > > > God', or 'in Thy light I see Light'. Shree Ramakrishna saw no > > > difference between what others > > > considered pure or impure. > > > > > > Which brings me to the following question: why do we have to > > > purify our hands after having touched the mouth? Is the mouth > > > considered to be impure? Why (especially since we have already > > > purified the mouth by rinsing it with Consciousness)? > > > > > > A: Thanks for bringing up these questions. > > > > > > We have often had discussions about this topic around here. > > > First and foremost we want remember to strive for an attitude of > > > the highest respect. Swamiji says that our focus must be on the > > > goal to make every offering convey the sincerity of our love and > > > devotion to God. Everything we serve and offer must be offered to > > God first. There are certain rules of purity which are > > > designed for this purpose. By following these rules of purity it > > > demonstrates our conscious longing to guide our awareness > > > into the presence of divinity. > > > > > > By not following these rules of purity like "aachamana" we create > > > what is known in Sanskrit as "jutha," defiled or impure. > Offerings > > > that are jutha are no longer suitable to be offered as an > offering > > > of respect to God, and should not even be accepted by devotees. We > > want to take prasad(sanctified offering) from God. We do not want > to > > give God our prasad. > > > > > > When we purify our mouth in the > > > puja we are purifying our mouth so we may speak words of > > > consciousness, not the gross level. If we touch our hand to our > > > mouth after that then we will have made our hand jutha and > > > everything we touch will be jutha as well and this will be > > > considered giving God our prasad. Therefore after our hand > > > touches our mouth we need to clean it off, too. > > > > > > Remember it is the conscious effort of our longing for that > > > highest station that is the offering. > > > > > > 3. Q: If something falls on the floor, why should it have become > > > impure? Is the floor impure? Why? If Consciousness pervades > > > all, how can anything be unpure or unfit to be offered to God? > > > > > > A: There are also certain rules of purity we follow when we cook > > > as well. In a similar way we do not taste the food before we > offer > > > it to God because that would be like giving God our prasad. > > > > > > Here is one example that came to mind on this topic: If I cook > > > something for Shree Maa and a piece of food falls on the floor I > > > will not put that food back on the plate and offer it to her even > > > though the mantra says the pure and the impure reside together. > > > Why? The mantra says: "apavitrah pavitro vaa..." Yes, God does > > > exist in the floor but still I want to convey to Maa the highest > > > respect and purity. I would not give Maa some food that had > > > fallen on the floor and then tell her that it is okay to eat this > food > > > because God also dwells in the floor. I think we need to have some > > discrimination. This is the same reason we do not offer to Agni the > > rice that has fallen on the floor. > > > > > > On the other hand there have been times when Maa has > > > accepted jutha offerings because "apavitrah pavitro vaa...." > > > > > > Remember that following these rules of purity help us to > > > consciously convey our sincere longing to become one with the > > > Highest Divinity and we will strive to convey this attitude of > > > respect with every action and towards everyone we meet. Henny, > > > don't worry, if you come over to dinner I will not offer you some > > > food that has fallen on the floor either.(lol) By the way, what > is > > > your favorite food to eat? > > > > > > 4. What does the term 'twice-born' mean in the mantra beginning > > > 'om tad vipra pipanova'? Does it refer to the state of the > > > performer of the puja? Who realizes that he/she is not the > > > performer at all? > > > > > > A: The twice born refers to the Brahmins who are born once from > > > the earthly womb and once from the womb of wisdom. > > > In this particular mantra we are addressing Vishnu who dwells > > > in the highest station of the Brahmin who is performing this puja. > > > > > > > > > Surya asked Swamiji these questions about Shiva puja: > > > > > > 1. I was just curious is this way of performing Shiva Puja unique > > > to this lineage or is this the way it is done in many lineages? > > > > > > A: Many lineages. > > > > > > 2. Also I just heard some various Vedic mantras chanted in > > > "Ghanam" style and was blown away by it. Since I remember > > > hearing that Swamiji could chant the entire Durga Saptashati > > > forwards and backwards, I was just wondering if he had ever > > > heard anyone chant the Sri Rudram and/or the Durga Saptashati > > > in this style? > > > > > > A: Yes. It is different from the pranayam styles which we employ, > > > and it is used for a different reason. > > > > > > > > > Q: Kalachandra asked: > > > "You will already have a small container of water > > > set up on your altar. You will use this water for aachamana. It > > > has not been purified yet but we will get to this soon. " Is this > the > > > same countainer I will use in the Om gange ....Is necessary > > > another countener? > > > > > > A: Yes. It is the same container for Om gange..... > > > You do not need another container. > > > > > > Om Namah Shivaaya! 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Guest guest Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Dear Kumari thank you very much for your kind response and for relieving me of worries about having offended you or anyone else. E-mail correspondence does that to you sometimes:). with love, Henny , "ty_maa" <ds.james@c...> wrote: > Dear Henny, > > I very much appreciated your questions on purity and impurity. > as Parvati mentioned, the topic comes up for discussion often. > > I know I also need to hear these things again and again. finally, it > all sinks in and becomes our nature. > > in my opinion, your example of Sri Ramakrishna was exact and well > stated. what better example could one use! > > I felt blessed to have received such a practical response about ritual > purity, and with a precious example from Maa's life. > > thank you for opening that discussion. this is what holy company and > satsangha is all about. > > > With Love, > Kumari > > > > > > , "henny_v_i" <HvI@S...> wrote: > > Namaste Kumari, > > > > > From examples like these in the lives of great souls, I have > > > understood that purity can be a matter of convention or etiquette > > or, > > > as in the life of Ramakrishna, it is often a matter of direct > > perception. > > > > > > My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions > > > of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they > > > will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained. > > > > Well said, I agree with you. I just wanted to say: I hope you'll > > understand that I did not mean to imply in my question that what was > > appropriate for Shri Ramakrishna should be appropriate for me. I > > mentioned His name because I wanted to make the point that the pure > > see purity everywhere and His was the best example that came to mind. > > The questions that followed were asked because I needed to hear the > > purpose of the rules (again), not to criticize their existence. > > > > with love, > > Henny > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- In , "ty_maa" <ds.james@c...> wrote: > > > thank you Parvati for your helpful comments on ceremonial purity > > > during worship. > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna did the worship for many years in the Kali Temple, > > and > > > during that time he scrupulously observed the Hindu rules of purity > > in > > > connection with the worship. > > > > > > He also considered ganges water greatly and literally purifying. > > > For example, when someone put a newspaper down in His room, after > > the > > > newspaper was removed, He would ask His attendant to sprinkle ganges > > > water in the spot where the newspaper was. If some impure person > > came > > > to see Him, He would also sprinkle ganges water in the spot where > > that > > > person sat. > > > > > > After practicing worship for many years, Ramakrishna reached a point > > > where He saw everything as the Divine Mother, and He was even > > offering > > > food to a cat at which point the Brahmin priests felt scandalized. > > > They at once called the Brahmani, who sent Mathur Babu to > > investigate. > > > Mathur came and watched Ramakrishna's worship from a distance. > > > Afterwards, Mathur told the Brahmin priests to let Ramakrishna > > worhsip > > > as He pleased since he saw the Mother in everything. He was in a > > high > > > state. > > > > > > From examples like these in the lives of great souls, I have > > > understood that purity can be a matter of convention or etiquette > > or, > > > as in the life of Ramakrishna, it is often a matter of direct > > perception. > > > > > > My belief is that it is appropriate for us to follow the conventions > > > of ritual purity as taught by our teachers, with the faith that they > > > will lead us to the state that Ramakrishna attained. > > > > > > > > > Jai Maa! > > > Kumari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "parv108" <parv108> wrote: > > > > Day 9: Q/A feedback > > > > > > > > Namaste to all, > > > > > > > > Henny asked the following questions: > > > > > > > > 1.I realize there are many levels of interpretation, but the > > mantras > > > > we learned concerning the seat (om kushasane..) and these > > > > new mantras for purification all refer in some way to the aspect > > > > of the Divine named > > > > Vishnu. I have wondered why; is it because Vishnu, or the All > > > > Pervading Consciousness, is stable (no waves or fluctuations to > > > > trouble the waters) and supporting (so we remain firm in our > > > > attention)? > > > > > > > > A: Swamiji says that Vishnu and Shiva are one. > > > > > > > > I like your interpretation that we remain firm in our attention > > > > because that is how Swamiji defines worship. Worship means > > > > to pay attention and we want to pay attention to every moment, > > > > every action. With attention every action we perform becomes a > > > > worship, a puja. > > > > > > > > Please look in the Bhagavad Gita as there are many references > > > > to purity as spoken by the Supreme Divinity(Krishna) to the > > > > Clarity of Devotion(Arjuna.) > > > > > > > > > > > > 2.Q:You asked us to pay special attention to the mantra > > > > beginning with:'om apavitrah...). As I understand it, this means > > > > that our minds interpret what we see as either pure or impure. If > > > > we look with divine eyes, there is no impurity to be seen. Beauty > > > > is in the eye of the beholder, or 'to see God you must become > > > > God', or 'in Thy light I see Light'. Shree Ramakrishna saw no > > > > difference between what others > > > > considered pure or impure. > > > > > > > > Which brings me to the following question: why do we have to > > > > purify our hands after having touched the mouth? Is the mouth > > > > considered to be impure? Why (especially since we have already > > > > purified the mouth by rinsing it with Consciousness)? > > > > > > > > A: Thanks for bringing up these questions. > > > > > > > > We have often had discussions about this topic around here. > > > > First and foremost we want remember to strive for an attitude of > > > > the highest respect. Swamiji says that our focus must be on the > > > > goal to make every offering convey the sincerity of our love and > > > > devotion to God. Everything we serve and offer must be offered to > > > God first. There are certain rules of purity which are > > > > designed for this purpose. By following these rules of purity it > > > > demonstrates our conscious longing to guide our awareness > > > > into the presence of divinity. > > > > > > > > By not following these rules of purity like "aachamana" we create > > > > what is known in Sanskrit as "jutha," defiled or impure. > > Offerings > > > > that are jutha are no longer suitable to be offered as an > > offering > > > > of respect to God, and should not even be accepted by devotees. We > > > want to take prasad(sanctified offering) from God. We do not want > > to > > > give God our prasad. > > > > > > > > When we purify our mouth in the > > > > puja we are purifying our mouth so we may speak words of > > > > consciousness, not the gross level. If we touch our hand to our > > > > mouth after that then we will have made our hand jutha and > > > > everything we touch will be jutha as well and this will be > > > > considered giving God our prasad. Therefore after our hand > > > > touches our mouth we need to clean it off, too. > > > > > > > > Remember it is the conscious effort of our longing for that > > > > highest station that is the offering. > > > > > > > > 3. Q: If something falls on the floor, why should it have become > > > > impure? Is the floor impure? Why? If Consciousness pervades > > > > all, how can anything be unpure or unfit to be offered to God? > > > > > > > > A: There are also certain rules of purity we follow when we cook > > > > as well. In a similar way we do not taste the food before we > > offer > > > > it to God because that would be like giving God our prasad. > > > > > > > > Here is one example that came to mind on this topic: If I cook > > > > something for Shree Maa and a piece of food falls on the floor I > > > > will not put that food back on the plate and offer it to her even > > > > though the mantra says the pure and the impure reside together. > > > > Why? The mantra says: "apavitrah pavitro vaa..." Yes, God does > > > > exist in the floor but still I want to convey to Maa the highest > > > > respect and purity. I would not give Maa some food that had > > > > fallen on the floor and then tell her that it is okay to eat this > > food > > > > because God also dwells in the floor. I think we need to have some > > > discrimination. This is the same reason we do not offer to Agni the > > > rice that has fallen on the floor. > > > > > > > > On the other hand there have been times when Maa has > > > > accepted jutha offerings because "apavitrah pavitro vaa...." > > > > > > > > Remember that following these rules of purity help us to > > > > consciously convey our sincere longing to become one with the > > > > Highest Divinity and we will strive to convey this attitude of > > > > respect with every action and towards everyone we meet. Henny, > > > > don't worry, if you come over to dinner I will not offer you some > > > > food that has fallen on the floor either.(lol) By the way, what > > is > > > > your favorite food to eat? > > > > > > > > 4. What does the term 'twice-born' mean in the mantra beginning > > > > 'om tad vipra pipanova'? Does it refer to the state of the > > > > performer of the puja? Who realizes that he/she is not the > > > > performer at all? > > > > > > > > A: The twice born refers to the Brahmins who are born once from > > > > the earthly womb and once from the womb of wisdom. > > > > In this particular mantra we are addressing Vishnu who dwells > > > > in the highest station of the Brahmin who is performing this puja. > > > > > > > > > > > > Surya asked Swamiji these questions about Shiva puja: > > > > > > > > 1. I was just curious is this way of performing Shiva Puja unique > > > > to this lineage or is this the way it is done in many lineages? > > > > > > > > A: Many lineages. > > > > > > > > 2. Also I just heard some various Vedic mantras chanted in > > > > "Ghanam" style and was blown away by it. Since I remember > > > > hearing that Swamiji could chant the entire Durga Saptashati > > > > forwards and backwards, I was just wondering if he had ever > > > > heard anyone chant the Sri Rudram and/or the Durga Saptashati > > > > in this style? > > > > > > > > A: Yes. It is different from the pranayam styles which we employ, > > > > and it is used for a different reason. > > > > > > > > > > > > Q: Kalachandra asked: > > > > "You will already have a small container of water > > > > set up on your altar. You will use this water for aachamana. It > > > > has not been purified yet but we will get to this soon. " Is this > > the > > > > same countainer I will use in the Om gange ....Is necessary > > > > another countener? > > > > > > > > A: Yes. It is the same container for Om gange..... > > > > You do not need another container. > > > > > > > > Om Namah Shivaaya! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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