To wmbittner about My Introduction to this Group

[Guest guest]

Dear wm ~ thank you so much for posting and introducing yourself to

us. What interested me in reading what you wrote was the similarity

in our spiritual journeys. I was baptized Episcopalian, then went to

Methodist Church because my father was Methodist. Then in my

pre-teens, my mother converted to Catholicism and took all of us

along for the ride. She didn't give us a choice. For me this turned

out to be very negative because on top of the abuse I was

experiencing at home, now I had, overlayered on top of that, concepts

which reinforced the beliefs that seemed to be part of the abuse ...

you're evil just because you exist, and even more so because you're a

woman; you have to watch your every thought and movement, and if you

slip up you will burn in hell, forever and forever and forever. I was

terrified by this. A teacher I had in a metaphysics class likened it

to me standing over myself with a baseball bat.

At some point I figured out that this was very unhealthy for me, but

before that point, I became what they called in the church,

"scrupulous," which is considered a "sin,"so it was a "Catch 22,"

lose, lose situation for me. I converted to Judiasm when I married my

first husband, but couldn't really get into it, though later on, when

I studied the Tarot, I became very interested in the Kabbalah. (Of

course, even to study the Tarot, I still had to shake out the

Catholic bats that were still left in my belfry.)

In my early 20's, I began to just somehow "come across" books about

Eastern Spirituality. One book, "The Wisdom of China and India,"

became a lifeline for me. It was there, in some of the ancient

Vedantic texts that were quoted from, that I found a spirituality

belief system that was predicated on the idea that we are all

essentially Divine. Of course we get sidetracked, lose our way,

become blinded to the knowledge of who we are, but this single idea

alone healed me in a huge way. I was also reading Suzuki's books on

Zen Buddhism and studying the ancient Goddess spirituality. (This

kind of dovetailed with what was going on in the art world at the

time, with women artists bringing the Goddess in all Her many forms

to the fore.) I was married (2nd marriage) in the Unitarian Church,

but like you, I found it too dry and political (and I was a political

"animal" who worked in that arena my entire career). I had a brief

encounter with Wicca and Native American Spirituality, and then I

discovered shamanism, which provided a context to understand some of

my experiences (visionary).

My sister took me to see Ammachi, and I went to see her for many

years. My sister also took me to see Karunamayi, and then my sister

discovered Shree Maa and Swamiji.

I remember her standing in my kitchen with a copy of a cassette tape,

being all excited and saying (paraphrase): "you just have to listen

to this; this is the most beautiful music I have ever heard, and

Shree Maa is my guru." As a result of this brief moment, I was drawn

to go and see Shree Maa and Swamiji during what became their last US

tour (though I hope not their final one). I was swept away. Then I

discovered this digest and began in my own baby steps way to

participate in group sankalpas and read sacred scriptures like the

Chandi Path, which had been translated by Swamiji. I was

enthusiastic, but something was not yet complete.

Then I had my "moment." The experience that so many people describe,

the moment when they knew with absolute clarity, "this is my guru."

Though I had heard it described many times in many different ways, I

had never experienced it. And then it happened. I fell in love with

the gurus. It was an absolute, total moment of fullness and clarity.

I think it would be hard to explain with mere words, although it

might be better referenced via poetry or art or music.

I also love Krishna Das. : ) I was fortunate to see him in concert

as part of a retreat/seminar that was held a few years ago in

Albuquerque. I listen to his cds all the time.

To me it was interesting that you used the word, "idol." Of course,

being initially a Christian, and then a Catholic, I was well aware of

the prohibition of idol worship, and as a feminist, I was also aware

of how much of the ancient Goddess tradition the church had absorbed

at the same time that it was grinding into the dust. Being an artist,

when I discovered the Gods and Goddesses of Hinduism, I had no

difficulty there, nor did I think of these Beings as "idols."

I believe that, as human beings, part of who we are is that we are

symbolic beings. Jung uncovered this and described it as archetypes.

And, of course, Hinduism is not the only existing spirituality belief

system in which there are multiple depictions of God/dess.

When I was living in Oregon, I went to Boise, Idaho, where there was a

wonderful Indian store at one of the malls. I would buy incense and

kum kum and marvel at the lovely saris. One day I had a talk with the

woman behind the counter. I had discovered a lovely statuette of

Ganesha and told her how much I loved it. Right away, she blushed and

said, "well we Hindus believe in One God." I realized what was

happening. I was sad that she felt she had to prove anything about

her spirituality. I said, Oh I know ... the one and the many. The

sigh of relief was audible, then she smiled at me and said, "exactly

so."

For me, all are one ... and since as humans we are so completely

unique in some ways, those spirituality belief systems which provide

a multiplicity of concrete, visual ways to "see" the Divine show a

deep, inherent understanding of this archetypal aspect of who we are.

So there is the idea of the "Ishta Devata" (the favorite deity), but I

love them all. Each carries with Her/Him essential aspects or

qualities, and so when we focus on one, we are perhaps focusing on

that quality or set of qualities. Like Laksmi, who is seen as the

Goddess of Wealth. But if you go beyond the surface of Laksmi, beyond

the surface idea of wealth, Laksmi becomes the Goddess of True Wealth.

So then we are led to begin an inquiry into the nature of True Wealth.

I totally believe in these Gods and Goddesses, and within different

belief systems, the names and faces change, but the essential

qualities remain. I also believe in avatars. I believe that Shree Maa

and Swamiji are avatars (Self-realized Souls), and they remain every

second in that aspect of Divinity, which shines forth in all they say

and do. I believe we are very fortunate that in this Kali Yuga time,

we are blessed to have a number of avatars and Great Souls walking

the earth, so that each, according to his/her temperament may find

his/her spiritual Home. I believe that I can be a devotee of Shree

Maa and Swamiji and also pray to Jesus. If you go to their homepage,

the changing images at the top include a picture of Jesus. Also, go

here:

http://ph./photos/browse/9b85?b=17&m=t&o=0

and you will see among the pictures, one called maa_Jesus.

Okay ... I'm writing a book now, so I'll stop. But isn't it

interesting how similar our paths have been. I'm glad you're here.

And the last paragraph to your post below says it all. If we all did

these actions that you write about, we would be going far along in

our journeys indeed.

Jai Maa , Jai Swamiji ~ Linda

wmbittner wrote:

By the way, I know I have not offically introduced myself....I am a

married, 39 y.o. American, with a 14 y.o. dauther, and works inweb

design and architecture.Grew up Christian/Charismatic/Catholic.

Belonged to aninterdenominational, Christian, Fundamentalist,

community.Re-discovered and fell in love with my Catholocism in

college. I fellaway from Catholocism after college, and started

reading a lot ofphilosophy, mythology, and texts from other

religions....Eventually, via Yogananda Paramahansa and Ekanath

Easwaran, Idiscovered Hinduism and Sri Ramakrishna, and fell in love

with theuniversalism of his Vedanta...I tried Unitarian Universalism,

and I was very comfortable with itsliberalism, tolerance, humanism,

focus on ethics, and universalism.But it lacked passion, devotion,

ritual, and "God-Talk."...I became a Reform Jew, learned a heck of a

lot, metwonderful people, including a wonderful Rabbi. But,

eventually, the fervor wore off. And some elements in Judaismwhich

bothered me slightly......I found myself at a point of not knowing

which religion I believed in.Each has its beauty and wisdom. But

each, for me, has things I'm not110% comfortable with. Christianity's

claim that Jesus is the only Sonof God, and the only way to Heaven.

Judaism's xenophobia. Hinduism'sfocus on idols. Islam's focus on

Muhammad. And so on.I am attracted to the Gods, Goddesses, and

Demi-Gods of Hinduism,especially Krishna and Hanuman. Because of

Krishna Das, I chant to theHindu Dieties all day long. The pujas and

ceremonies I have seen areso beutiful to me. But the rational side of

me says they are justsuperstitions, and the Dieties are myths and

never existed...Then, by way of his podcasts on podcast.net, I

discovered SwamiSatyananda Saraswati, and soon after, Sree Maa. What

attracted me mostto Swami was his voice, passion, intonation, and

authority. I spenthours browsing their site, listening to audio

classes, and watchingtheir videos. And I'm absolutely loving what I

have found. There is somuch wisdom and so much confirmation about

things I have alwaysbelieved. I love Swami's humor, wisdom, and

energy. And I love Maa'slove, wisdom, and laugh. ...Is praying to

idols right or wrong? Do I want to go back to praying toJesus? Will I

ever find a religion or community I can comfortably takepart in where

I live? Are the Hindu Dieties myths, manifestations,neither, or both?

Are Shree Maa and Swami avatars, completelyenlightenend souls,

extremely wise people, or (no disrespect intended)just plain nuts?

Meanwhile, until these questions or issues are resolved (and they

maynever be), at the present, I will continue to study the

Hindu/Vedanticscriptures, lives of holy men and woman, listen to

Swami's classes,read his and her books, listen to Krishna Das,

meditate when I can andthink about God when I can't, work to serve

others selfishly, meet andlisten to people from other faiths, and

love and serve my family...

[Guest guest]

, nierika wrote:

> To me it was interesting that you used the word, "idol." Of course,

being

> initially a Christian, and then a Catholic, I was well aware of the

prohibition

> of idol worship

 

My concern is not whether this is wrong or evil. I absolutely don't.

I'm just wary of if being mere superstition. I really feel that it

isn't. It's just as you said, bats flying around.

>I had discovered a lovely statuette of Ganesha and told her how much I

> loved it. Right away, she blushed and said, "well we Hindus believe

in One

> God." I realized what was happening. I was sad that she felt she

had to prove

> anything about her spirituality.

 

I read a similar story of a visitor to a Hindu temple, looking at all

the idols, when one of the priests stood beside him and said "God is one."

> Each carries with Her/Him

> essential aspects or qualities, and so when we focus on one, we are

perhaps

> focusing on that quality or set of qualities.

 

I myself have read alot of Joseph Campbell and Jung. So I totally get

the archetype thing.

 

I thought this morning, someone could claim and believe that the

individual Gods and Goddesses do not exist. And they are just ideals.

Why would one worship an ideal? But then I thought, when you look at

the big picture, maybe ideals are really the only things that truly

exist. And that which we think exists, is actually illusion and

transitory.

 

It also made me think, and this is a question for many people: I have

read that a God/Goddess or a representation of a God/Goddess is an

ideal that one is trying to immitate and become. There are a few

people that I have admired, but aren't readily recognized as saints or

avatars, and definitely not Gods/Goddesses. Like Mr. Rogers. Would it

make sense then to put a picture of someone like Mr. Rogers on an

altar? And what about mythical/fictional characters that represent an

ideal, like a character from a movie or book that showed tremendous

character and compassion? I'm not trying to be facitious. Just thinking.