to Ericji: Types of Bhakti -how they affect interpretation of scriptures

[Guest guest]

Jai Maa, Ericji!

 

Your post is kissed with so much wisdom. i bow to you! BTW, the Sri

Ramakrishna Chameleon teaching story is one of my all time

favorites! :<)

 

Your sister beyond forever,

muktimaa

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, "ecjensen_us" <ecjensen_us

wrote:

>

> OM NAMAH SIVAYA

>

> yes Steve very true, but study and practice, as you imply are two

> different things. and Srini clarified his comments so it is all

> water under(over?) the bridge. my reason for responding was only

> that people can categorize everything, make judgments, and then put

> their purity and ideals in a trophy case and proudly display them

on

> the mantle. to give you an example, you have a wife and family,

yet

> are very devoted to your spiritual practice. and assume your wife

> wants a physical relationship with you. so given the previous

> example of purity vs. seed, if you were to leave your wife and

> family to go live at the Mandir, would that be pure or an attempt

to

> fullfill your selfish desires? and is loving your wife physically,

> in this instance a selfish desire or selflessness? which is dharma?

>

> its like the story where 4 different people see the chameleon in

the

> tree at different times. one says it is red. one blue, one green,

> and one orange. and a argument ensues over the REAL color. a man

> sitting under the tree the whole time says everyone is right it is

> really all colors. to me God is the chameleon. God is all

colors.

> it's not your way or my way because it's really our way. ONE way.

>

> JAI MAA

>

> \, "Steve Connor" <sconnor@>

> wrote:

> >

> > some of the names of Shiva ... it would be nice to know what they

> are

> > about ... the particular one in question, i think we should know

> how

> > to interpret it. anybody know the story there?

> >

> > re: categorizing devotion ... my feeling is, when any concept is

> being

> > discussed, it might be useful to categorized in order to further

> study

> > it ... and, to motivate to the highest possibility ... but for the

> > individual, it is usually not useful to dwell on "what kind of

> > devotion do i have?" ... unless the person is going through a real

> > eye-opening life change, discovering his devotion is really about

> > getting things for himself, etc.

> >

> >

> > , "ecjensen_us" <ecjensen_us@>

> wrote:

> > >

> > > OM NAMAH SIVAYA

> > >

> > > there is so much truth in what you write. thank you for this. i

> am

> > > no scholar nor that advanced but to me it seems the key to all

> these

> > > categories/labels is the intention. women = desires/attachments

> or

> > > gold = resources needed to fulfill these desires, depends on

our

> > > intention. Is it absolute? does sattvic devotion really imply

> purity

> > > over sperm? are they even comparable? i think Purity is about

> the

> > > heart. Purity is about Love and about intention.

> worship/sadhana is

> > > to bring us closer to the Love of Creator. Creation is part of

> the

> > > creator. Sperm is a large factor in the ability to create. so

> maybe

> > > sperm is more pure than you think. a fire can also have these

> same 4

> > > qualities. What makes a fire sattvic? to me, it's the

intention

> of

> > > user of fire, not the fire. what is more important, the type of

> > > bhakti/devotion we have for our beloved or the devotion itself?

> i

> > > think it's a process and can't be compartmentalized. for me

> anyway.

> > >

> > > i not sure about you but it is a struggle for me at times no

> doubt.

> > > Shree Maa and Swamiji have shown me that sadhana takes me to

The

> > > Pure Love of The Beloved. my experience has been The Love is

> leading

> > > me towards the purity not the other way around. isn't The Love

> > > ultimately beyond(greater) than duality, ie. 3 gunas, pure vs

> impure?

> > >

> > > JAI MAA

> > >

> > >

> > > , "srini_sadhu"

<srini_sadhu@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Family

> > > >

> > > > A few weeks ago we were all discussing "Devotion" on the

> group -

> > > do

> > > > you remember? Swamiji said that the Devi Gita defines four

> types

> > > of

> > > > devotion:

> > > >

> > > > Tamasic: the object of your prayer is negative, e.g., you

pray

> > > that

> > > > your enemies suffer.

> > > > Rajasic: the object of your prayer is to fulfill your own

> selfish

> > > > desires.

> > > > Sattvic: The object of your prayer is to purify your self.

> > > > Para Bhakti: You pray because you love Her. You feel that it

> is a

> > > > privilege to worship and pray. You are not asking Her for

> anything.

> > > >

> > > > Every person has a mix of the three gunas. When we read

> > > scriptures,

> > > > we interpret them in accordance with the guna that is

> predominant

> > > in

> > > > us. Similarly, when Sadhus translate scriptures, they choose

> > > > meanings and interpretations based on their ideals and

goals.

> For

> > > > example, in most of Thakur Ramakrishna's books we frequently

> see

> > > > Thankur talk about "kamini" and "kanchan" -- these words are

> often

> > > > translated as "woman" and "gold". In Maa and Swamiji's book

> on

> > > Sri

> > > > Ramakrishna, "kamini" is translated as "desires and

> attachments"

> > > > and "kanchan" as "resources needed to fulfill these

desires".

> > > >

> > > > Similarly, in every Sahasranama there are several meanings

for

> > > each

> > > > sanskrit name. For example, in Kali Sahasranaam, we find

many

> > > names

> > > > containing the word "Shukra". If you look in the Monier-

> William's

> > > > Sanskrit - English Dictionary, you will find several inches

of

> > > > meanings for Shukra -- pure, bright, resplendent,

spotless ...

> and

> > > > name of a month, the planet Venus, sperm, a good action, and

> so

> > > on.

> > > > If we are Sattvic Devotees, which meaning would we use? I

> would

> > > > think "pure" as opposed to "sperm"!

> > > >

> > > > The main point is that the translator chooses that meaning

> that is

> > > > consistent with Her ideal of perfection, the type of Bhakti

> that

> > > She

> > > > feels for Her Beloved. It is also important that the

> translation

> > > > be consistent throughout the scripture -- Here again we see

> that

> > > > Swamiji consistently translates Shukra as purity and we have

> so

> > > many

> > > > beautiful names coming forth - which inspire us to rise

> higher

> > > and

> > > > feel pure love for our Beloved.

> > > >

> > > > I look forwrad to your comments on this.

> > > >

> > > > with love and prayers

> > > > srini

> > > >

> > >

> >

>