vivekachUdAmani

[Guest guest]

 

List for advaita vedanta as taught by Shri Shankara

[ADVAITA-L] On Behalf Of Vaidya N. Sundaram

Thursday, January 28, 1999 11:52 AM

ADVAITA-L

vivekachUdAmani

 

38)

durvaarasa.nsaaradavaagnitaptaM

dodhuuyamaanaM duradR^ishhTavaataiH .

bhiitaM prapannaM paripaahi mR^ityoH

sharaNyamanyadyadahaM na jaane ..

 

I am scorched by the inextinguishable forest fire of samsAra. I am

deeply affected (shaken) by the winds of misfortune. I am overcome

by intense fear. I fall at your feet. Save me from death. I have

none else in whom I can seek refuge.

 

SamsAra itself is a forest fire which spreads in all directions.

It is in extinguishable except by the jn~aana springing from the

guru's upadesha. When the forest fire is aided by the wind, the

flames spread out and scorch in all directions. The winds here are

said to be duradrstavaataah, i.e., winds of misfortune. They are

unfavourable winds. dodhUyamaanam : trembling greatly again and

again. If the wind is favourable, it carries the person away from

the flames. If it is unfavourable, either it carries him into the

fire or blows the fire on him. It is with the idea that the man

suffering from the heat of the forest fire will be rescued from it

by the downpour of the nectar that reference is made in the

previous sloka to the raining of the amrta of the guru's compassion

by the expression atIkaarunyasudhaabhivrstyaa making it an

adjective of drstyaa and the whole being taken as a bahuvrIhi -

compound. Instead, it may also be taken as tatpurusa - compound.

drstyaa - by your glance, atIkArunyasudhaabhivrstyaa: by the down

pour of infinite compassion through it. the purport of the sisya's

appeal is : If I obtain Atmajn~Ana by your grace, death in the form

of the exit of the vital airs from my body will not happen to me".

The sruti also says: na tasya prAnA utkrAmanti atraiva

samavanIyante (Brh): His (Atmajn~Anin's) prAnas do not go away;

they disappear (acquire laya) here itself. That is, the man does

not die as ordinary people do by their vital airs going out of the

body at death.

 

 

Vaidya N. Sundaram

 

Harsha: Thank you for this gem. I will take the liberty to post on other

lists and ask a question. In Yoga, they say that when Shakti Joins

Shiva at Sahasarara, this union results in liberation, and at death of the

body the Prana exits through the Sahasarara resulting in Maha Samadhi. The

exit through the Sahasarara is meant to be a sign of the final Mukti.

However, on the path of Jnana, the pranas do not exit but are absorbed into

the Heart that is the Self. How do we reconcile these two seemingly

divergent explanations?

[Guest guest]

If I may comment on this question as to there being an apparent

contradiction, let me say that this is only from the limited perspective of

the intellect. The intellect is trying to apply limitations found in the

physical universe to an experience that is transendental in nature, and such

limitations do not exist.

If I may use an analogy let me put it this way. If you were in a submarine

and went out through a torpedo tube or the hatch it does not matter you are

going to be in the ocean (merge) those in the sub may talk among themselves

discussing the nature of your exit as if it were the thing of importance,

but for one who has truly experienced it, the merging is the only thing of

importance. Not whether he left through the hatch or torpedo tube, to him

both are the same.

 

Respectfully,

Don

 

Harsha (Dr. Harsh K. Luthar) <hluthar

'List for advaita vedanta as taught by Shri Shankara'

<ADVAITA-L; advaitin <advaitin >;

< >

Friday, January 29, 1999 6:18 AM

Re: vivekachUdAmani

 

>"Harsha (Dr. Harsh K. Luthar)" <hluthar

>

>

>List for advaita vedanta as taught by Shri Shankara

>[ADVAITA-L] On Behalf Of Vaidya N. Sundaram

>Thursday, January 28, 1999 11:52 AM

>ADVAITA-L

>vivekachUdAmani

>

>38)

>durvaarasa.nsaaradavaagnitaptaM

> dodhuuyamaanaM duradR^ishhTavaataiH .

>bhiitaM prapannaM paripaahi mR^ityoH

> sharaNyamanyadyadahaM na jaane ..

>

> I am scorched by the inextinguishable forest fire of samsAra. I am

>deeply affected (shaken) by the winds of misfortune. I am overcome

>by intense fear. I fall at your feet. Save me from death. I have

>none else in whom I can seek refuge.

>

> SamsAra itself is a forest fire which spreads in all directions.

>It is in extinguishable except by the jn~aana springing from the

>guru's upadesha. When the forest fire is aided by the wind, the

>flames spread out and scorch in all directions. The winds here are

>said to be duradrstavaataah, i.e., winds of misfortune. They are

>unfavourable winds. dodhUyamaanam : trembling greatly again and

>again. If the wind is favourable, it carries the person away from

>the flames. If it is unfavourable, either it carries him into the

>fire or blows the fire on him. It is with the idea that the man

>suffering from the heat of the forest fire will be rescued from it

>by the downpour of the nectar that reference is made in the

>previous sloka to the raining of the amrta of the guru's compassion

>by the expression atIkaarunyasudhaabhivrstyaa making it an

>adjective of drstyaa and the whole being taken as a bahuvrIhi -

>compound. Instead, it may also be taken as tatpurusa - compound.

>drstyaa - by your glance, atIkArunyasudhaabhivrstyaa: by the down

>pour of infinite compassion through it. the purport of the sisya's

>appeal is : If I obtain Atmajn~Ana by your grace, death in the form

>of the exit of the vital airs from my body will not happen to me".

>The sruti also says: na tasya prAnA utkrAmanti atraiva

>samavanIyante (Brh): His (Atmajn~Anin's) prAnas do not go away;

>they disappear (acquire laya) here itself. That is, the man does

>not die as ordinary people do by their vital airs going out of the

>body at death.

>

>

> Vaidya N. Sundaram

>

>Harsha: Thank you for this gem. I will take the liberty to post on other

>lists and ask a question. In Yoga, they say that when Shakti Joins

>Shiva at Sahasarara, this union results in liberation, and at death of the

>body the Prana exits through the Sahasarara resulting in Maha Samadhi. The

>exit through the Sahasarara is meant to be a sign of the final Mukti.

>However, on the path of Jnana, the pranas do not exit but are absorbed into

>the Heart that is the Self. How do we reconcile these two seemingly

>divergent explanations?

>

>

>------

>To from this mailing list, or to change your subscription

>to digest, go to the ONElist web site, at and

>select the User Center link from the menu bar on the left.

>

[Guest guest]

This is continuation of an earlier important dialogue. I had written the

following in response to a message on Vivekachudamani.

 

Harsha: In Yoga, they say that when Shakti Joins

>Shiva at Sahasarara, this union results in liberation, and at death of the

>body the Prana exits through the Sahasarara resulting in Maha Samadhi. The

>exit through the Sahasarara is meant to be a sign of the final Mukti.

>However, on the path of Jnana, the pranas do not exit but are absorbed into

>the Heart that is the Self. How do we reconcile these two seemingly

>divergent explanations?

 

<< "Donald Forsyth" <ddforsyth replied as follows:

 

Don: If I may comment on this question as to there being an apparent

contradiction, let me say that this is only from the limited perspective of

the intellect. The intellect is trying to apply limitations found in the

physical universe to an experience that is transendental in nature, and such

limitations do not exist.

If I may use an analogy let me put it this way. If you were in a submarine

and went out through a torpedo tube or the hatch it does not matter you are

going to be in the ocean (merge) those in the sub may talk among themselves

discussing the nature of your exit as if it were the thing of importance,

but for one who has truly experienced it, the merging is the only thing of

importance. Not whether he left through the hatch or torpedo tube, to him

both are the same.

 

Respectfully,

Don

 

Harsha: Thanks for your remarks Don. I fully agree with the spirit of your

insights.

 

Here is what GM wrote in response to the same question (Advaita list given at

the bottom). You and the list members might enjoy the response.

 

GM: Having learnt/practiced Kundalini yoga and then atma vichara for a while,

it is my feeling that the explanations are not divergent but depends on

how one defines mukti.

 

According to yoga, when prana leaves thro' sahasarara, then one goes to

Brahmaloka, never to return to "mortal" existence and is liberated from

the cycle of births and deaths. Advaita does not disagree with the concept

of Brahmaloka etc. (see Madhusudana sarasvati's commentary relating to

attaining Brahmaloka through bhakti alone).

 

However, the real advaitic stance is more logical and stringent.

Mukti is something that is "attained" right now. It is only a "rediscovering"

of the Self by the removal of (avidya, dvaita. There is nothing to attain,

only the avidya has to leave.

 

My experience, based on my Guru's words, is this : "Exercises" like

Kundalini yoga, kriya yoga etc etc. are all _very_ useful till a stage,

when adequate concentration and chitta shuddhi is attained. Later, all

these practices have to be essentially looked upon as "unreal" and the

mind turned inward to realize the Self by atma vichara. Essentially,

all these yogic practices are useful till one has the "maturity" to look upon

all the lokas (including this one) as unreal and concentrate on the Real.

 

AUM shaantiH

 

gm

 

================================================================

"bhava shankara deshikame sharaNam"

List archives : http://listserv.tamu.edu/archives/advaita-l.html

=