Guest guest Posted April 3, 1999 Report Share Posted April 3, 1999 On Fri, 02 Apr 1999 20:26:45 -0800 Tim Gerchmez <fewtch writes: >Tim Gerchmez <fewtch > > >Dear List(s), > >Despite detachment, dispassion and all that, the escalating violence >in >Yugoslavia is beginning to affect me. If we are truly all One, then >what >is done in one part of the world, to just one person, affects each one >of >us, and thousands upon thousands of people are suffering and fighting >and >raging over this war. It cannot help but begin to touch even the >most >dispassionate among us eventually, if one has even a shred of a heart >inside. > >I am truly and deeply saddened and depressed over the situation. >Three >American soldiers are held in captivity, and have obviously been >beaten >senseless. There is little chance of them being released anytime >soon, >although Milosevich doesn't dare kill them. Downtown Belgrade is in >flames. Thousands have been displaced from their homes and torn from >their families, and hundreds more per day. > This last is the real tragedy -- the *hundreds of thousands* of refugees pouring into Albania and Macedonia, countries so poor that their own citizens are among the most destitute in Europe. Physical destruction can be repaired, for all their obvious suffering the American soldiers are trained, volunteer professionals who know the risks inherent in their duties, but the wholesale, often murderous rousting of the Kosovar Albanians comprises suffering on a massive and wrenching scale. Tim rightly points to the whole morass as a case of ego gone amok, but it's a complex, multi- level phenomenon. Milosevich is using the ethnic/religious identity of his constituents (make no mistake about it, the man has substantial support and the skills to cultivate it) to manipulate them into atrocity. Drawing on centuries of Serbian repression and the consequent multi-generational resentments, he motivates the Soviet-equipped Yugoslavian military to reassert ancestral "rights" to sovereignty over traditionally "Serbian" territory (Kosovo has few Serb inhabitants, but figures prominently in Serbian history) and dominion over the non-Serbs therein. The question is, can there be any positive outcome without a radical change in consciousness of both leaders and those who are lead? Is there any solution in the externalized law of fear and obedience, or is any such activity a temporary bandage over a wound that will almost certainly hemorrhage again within the next few months or years, if not in the perennially bleeding Balkans, then perhaps in the Middle East, the north of Ireland, the quietly seething Indian subcontinent, or at the always-tense 38th parallel between a Korea that starves under inflexible leadership and another that feeds the insatiable western appetite for manufactured goods? >ALL OF THIS... starting from the actions of just *one ego*. THINK >ABOUT >THAT. I'm positive that Milosevich wouldn't care if the entire world >were in flames, as long as he kept his position of power. > Millions of Serbs (the other Balkan ethnicities are no better, but the Serbs have the military hardware) are so resentful (like the "good" Germans of the 1930s) that they are more than willing to follow. Without this complicity of *millions* of wounded, security-seeking egos, Milosevich would be a powerless clown. >Let this be a lesson to us all: EGO KILLS. The ego of Milosevich, >the ego of the U.N. delegates, The U.N. has nothing to with it -- *this* time. >the ego of President Clinton. I wonder if he really has any choice, and if the real tragedy of Kosovo could have really been stopped by any measure available to NATO -- aren't the "economic" sanctions on the already- tyrannized people of Iraq and Cuba just a somewhat quieter version of the very same violence that rains deadly ordnance down on Belgrade and Pristina? >These egos are >killing thousands. Yes, and it is yet another iteration of the identity-based conflict that has persisted throughout human history -- there is really nothing new or even extraordinary about it, and *that* is the underlying tragedy of which the Kosovo crisis is only the current expression. Without a radical and widespread shift in human consciousness, it cannot and will not end. >Even though it may be all on the level of 'maya', and >all these nonexistent egos are killing these people who are incapable >of dying on the level of Self, the suffering is very real. Very, very >real indeed to the people who are experiencing it. > You bet! >In Pain, > >Tim > Right there with you! Bruce http://www.users.uniserve.com/~samuel/brucemrg.htm http://www.users.uniserve.com/~samuel/brucsong.htm m(_ _)m _ _________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 1999 Report Share Posted April 3, 1999 At 12:45 AM 4/3/99 -0500, you wrote: >Bruce Morgen <editor >This last is the real tragedy >-- the *hundreds of thousands* >of refugees pouring into Albania >and Macedonia, countries so >poor that their own citizens >are among the most destitute in >Europe. I agree... this is the most tragic part of the whole scenario. Also, men are supposedly being separated from their families and carried away in trucks (presumably to be killed), while women and children are being forced over the border. This, also, is tragic in the extreme. The forced breakup of family structure is one of the most destructive acts that can be perpetrated on the human psyche. >Tim rightly points to the whole morass as a case of ego gone >amok, but it's a complex, multi-level phenomenon. Milosevich is >using the ethnic/religious identity of his constituents (make no mistake about it, the man has substantial support and >the skills to cultivate it) to manipulate them into atrocity. Echoes of the "Third Reich?" The situation has been compared to Pol Pot and the past situation in Cambodia, but it appears to me to more concretely reflect Hitler's Germany of the 1940's. Perhaps people are simply reluctant even to mention Hitler's name, a form of avoidance or "political correctness." >The question is, can there be any positive outcome without a >radical change in consciousness of both leaders and those who are >lead? The question is essentially moot, as the chances of a "radical change in consciousness" of the leaders and those who are lead (in this case) is virtually nil. >The U.N. has nothing to with it -- *this* time. I doubt that reducing Yugoslavia to ashes is going to "solve anything" in the long run. They may not have anything to do with it, but they certainly aren't helping... and helping is "supposed to be" their function. >>These egos are >>killing thousands. > >Yes, and it is yet another iteration of the identity-based >conflict that has persisted throughout human history -- >there is really nothing new or even extraordinary about it, and >*that* is the underlying tragedy of which the Kosovo >crisis is only the current expression. Without a radical >and widespread shift in human consciousness, it cannot and will >not end. Agreed. However, no matter how many times it happens, it's still painful to watch. It's even more "painful" to realize that such a radical shift in human consciousness is unlikely to ever take place. The "human animal" is usually more "animal" than "human," and although great weight is put on "the human potential" these days, I have to wonder... and watch as history is repeated again and again and again, with no learning taking place... not even on the level of shallow thought! Tim ----- Visit The Core of the WWW at: http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/ND/index.html Poetry, Writings, Live Chat on Spiritual Topics. Tim's Windows and DOS Shareware/Freeware is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/shareware.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 1999 Report Share Posted April 3, 1999 On Fri, 02 Apr 1999 23:44:49 -0800 Tim Gerchmez <fewtch writes: >Tim Gerchmez <fewtch > >At 12:45 AM 4/3/99 -0500, you wrote: >>Bruce Morgen <editor > >>This last is the real tragedy >>-- the *hundreds of thousands* >>of refugees pouring into Albania >>and Macedonia, countries so >>poor that their own citizens >>are among the most destitute in >>Europe. > >I agree... this is the most tragic part of the whole scenario. Also, >men >are supposedly being separated from their families and carried away >in >trucks (presumably to be killed), while women and children are being >forced >over the border. This, also, is tragic in the extreme. The forced >breakup >of family structure is one of the most destructive acts that can be >perpetrated on the human psyche. > >>Tim rightly points to the whole morass as a case of ego gone >>amok, but it's a complex, multi-level phenomenon. Milosevich is >>using the ethnic/religious identity of his constituents >(make no mistake about it, the man has substantial support and >>the skills to cultivate it) to manipulate them into atrocity. > >Echoes of the "Third Reich?" The situation has been compared to Pol >Pot >and the past situation in Cambodia, but it appears to me to more >concretely >reflect Hitler's Germany of the 1940's. More like the mid-'30s Third Reich, but I agree that the Pol Pot comparison doesn't stand up at all/ >Perhaps people are simply >reluctant even to mention Hitler's name, a form of avoidance or >"political correctness." > It'd sure be ironic, since the Serbs were major victims of the Nazis and one of the reasons for Serbian antipathy for Croats is Croat-German collaboration during WWII. It seems what we learn best from persecution is how to become effective persecutors. >>The question is, can there be any positive outcome without a >>radical change in consciousness of both leaders and those who are >>lead? > >The question is essentially moot, as the chances of a "radical change >in consciousness" of the leaders and those who are lead (in this case) >is virtually nil. > You are certainly correct in a short-term context. >>The U.N. has nothing to with it -- *this* time. > >I doubt that reducing Yugoslavia to ashes is going to "solve anything" >in the long run. They may not have anything to do with it, but they >certainly >aren't helping... and helping is "supposed to be" their function. > The U.N. Security Council is powerless when the interests of veto-wielding members are involved. In this case, several of those members are the pillars of NATO, so U.N. involvement would amount to pointless posturing. >>>These egos are >>>killing thousands. >> >>Yes, and it is yet another iteration of the identity-based >>conflict that has persisted throughout human history -- >>there is really nothing new or even extraordinary about it, and >>*that* is the underlying tragedy of which the Kosovo >>crisis is only the current expression. Without a radical >>and widespread shift in human consciousness, it cannot and will >>not end. > >Agreed. However, no matter how many times it happens, it's still >painful >to watch. It's even more "painful" to realize that such a radical >shift in human consciousness is unlikely to ever take place. In that case you'd better hope those "Maitreya" folks in London aren't the wishful thinkers I've seen them to be and that some spectacular event on a planetary scale is going to happen "real soon now." >The "human animal" is >usually more "animal" than "human," There has never been a non-human species that engages in deliberate, systematic cruelty on anything near the human scale. Imho your statement slanders animals, who have no choice about conforming to their genetically conferred natures. >and although great weight is put on >"the human potential" these days, I have to wonder... and watch as >history >is repeated again and again and again, with no learning taking >place... not even on the level of shallow thought! > Actually, only the shallow lessons are learned -- and perhaps there have been some minor improvements in this century. We have learned to "contain" tyrants when force suffices to do so -- confining Saddam Hussein to Iraq is better than appeasing Hitler was a half-century earlier, but again this is just dressing the wound without treating the underlying infection, and the most vulnerable continue to bear the brunt of the suffering. http://www.users.uniserve.com/~samuel/brucemrg.htm http://www.users.uniserve.com/~samuel/brucsong.htm m(_ _)m _ _________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 1999 Report Share Posted April 3, 1999 At 04:16 AM 4/3/99 -0500, you wrote: >>The "human animal" is >>usually more "animal" than "human," > >There has never been a non-human species that >engages in deliberate, systematic cruelty on >anything near the human scale. Imho your >statement slanders animals, who have no >choice about conforming to their genetically >conferred natures. In this case, I was using the third definition of "animal" that my dictionary specifies: an•i•mal (an‚ƒ mƒl) n. 3. a brutish or beastlike person. No insult intended to the rest of the animal kingdom, as I agree with you 100% that the species Homo Sapiens in general demonstrates far less dignity, harmony with nature and even sanity than any other species. Tim ----- Visit The Core of the WWW at: http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/ND/index.html Poetry, Writings, Live Chat on Spiritual Topics. Tim's Windows and DOS Shareware/Freeware is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/shareware.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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