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Greetings Brothers and Sisters,

 

It came to me after the Gayatri in Bhajans yesterday. An Avatar is a

descended Jivanmukti as opposed to a Master or a Bhodisattva, who put

off Moksha.

 

I know this is in duality, but it is real whilst one is in it Sankara

said. One doesn't become an Adwaitin until Moksha, before that it is an

intellectual exercise.

 

Love and Sai Ram,Tony.

 

_______

 

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At 10:48 AM 4/9/99 -0700, you wrote:

>One doesn't become an Adwaitin until Moksha, before that it is an

>intellectual exercise.

 

I don't agree with this at all. There is often a gradual realization on a

deep level completely apart from intellectual thought. What you're saying

is akin to "one doesn't become an automobile driver until one owns a racecar."

 

With Love,

 

Tim

 

 

-----

Visit The Core of the WWW at:

http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/ND/index.html

Music, Poetry, Writings on Nondual Spiritual Topics.

 

Tim's Windows and DOS Shareware/Freeware is at:

http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/shareware.html

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And I wonder, why are labels important anyway, and to whom

they are important?

And why are we constantly projecting glorious futures to

"liberate" us from the intolerable present moment?

 

Just wondering ...

Phil

 

> Tim Gerchmez <fewtch

>

> At 10:48 AM 4/9/99 -0700, you wrote:

>

> >One doesn't become an Adwaitin until Moksha, before that

it is an

> >intellectual exercise.

>

> I don't agree with this at all. There is often a gradual

realization on a

> deep level completely apart from intellectual thought.

What you're saying

> is akin to "one doesn't become an automobile driver until

one owns a racecar."

>

> With Love,

>

> Tim

>

>

> -----

> Visit The Core of the WWW at:

> http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/ND/index.html

> Music, Poetry, Writings on Nondual Spiritual Topics.

>

> Tim's Windows and DOS Shareware/Freeware is at:

> http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/shareware.html

>

> ------------------------

---------------

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At 08:52 PM 4/9/99 -0500, you wrote:

>"Phillip Burton" <p_burton

>

>And I wonder, why are labels important anyway, and to whom

>they are important?

 

Excellent questions. The answer to the first seems to be that labels are

important only to the ego. As to the second, "nobody" seems to be

appropriate :-)

>And why are we constantly projecting glorious futures to

>"liberate" us from the intolerable present moment?

 

Another good question. It's difficult to escape from the dualistic view of

psychological time, most of us were raised from infanthood to recognize it.

However, there *IS* "clock-time" as a fairly objective fact, and often it

does take some "clock-time" to clear away the dross of ignorance that keeps

us from recognizing what we truly are *NOW*.

 

With Love,

 

Tim

>> Tim Gerchmez <fewtch

>>

>> At 10:48 AM 4/9/99 -0700, you wrote:

>>

>> >One doesn't become an Adwaitin until Moksha, before that

>it is an

>> >intellectual exercise.

>>

>> I don't agree with this at all. There is often a gradual

>realization on a

>> deep level completely apart from intellectual thought.

>What you're saying

>> is akin to "one doesn't become an automobile driver until

>one owns a racecar."

 

 

-----

Visit The Core of the WWW at:

http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/ND/index.html

Music, Poetry, Writings on Nondual Spiritual Topics.

 

Tim's Windows and DOS Shareware/Freeware is at:

http://www.eskimo.com/~fewtch/shareware.html

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You wrote:

It's difficult to escape from the dualistic view of

>psychological time, most of us were raised from infanthood to

recognize it.

> However, there *IS* "clock-time" as a fairly objective fact, and

often it

>does take some "clock-time" to clear away the dross of ignorance that

keeps

>us from recognizing what we truly are *NOW*.

 

Yes, this seems true to me, or rather, in my case, there are periodic

recognitions of Now and a gradual increase in capacity to stay Here.

This gradual expansion has been a big surprise to me (along with all

the unexpected physical manifestations) -- so much of the literature

describes realization in its non-linear aspect. Can anybody recommend

some good writing on the process? I seem to be too stubborn for Grace

to liberate me in an instant! Holly

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Phillip Burton wrote:

> And I wonder, why are labels important anyway,

 

to tell the difference between canned corned and canned carrots.

> and to whom they are important?

 

people that don't like carrots.

> And why are we constantly projecting glorious futures to

> "liberate" us from the intolerable present moment?

 

while we project the eternal now is like a wound, it comes in many forms,

unbearable loneliness is one of them. ego would have us believe this moment

is intolerable and boring and painful and one will just keep fighting it until

one is ready to die. seriously though, I don't mind carrots, they are wonderful

for healthy vision. : )

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At 08:24 AM 4/10/99 -0500, you wrote:

>hbarrett (Holly N. Barrett, Ph.D.)

> I seem to be too stubborn for Grace

>to liberate me in an instant! Holly

 

When in search of the blissful grace of Grace*,

we're often caught in an endless 'rat race'.

Seaching... here and there, all over the place,

we find of our Grace*... not the slightest trace.

 

'Tis when we 'give up' our seach throughout 'Hell',

and sit down... and ponder on It*... a spell,

It* rubs against us... and 'purrs in our ear,

"I AM*... always now... I AM*... always here."

 

* whatever name or word the reader chooses.

 

 

( /\ ) Namaste,

 

sam

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