Guest guest Posted June 10, 1999 Report Share Posted June 10, 1999 ---------- >Bruce Morgen <editor > > JnanaBanana.... >Thu, Jun 10, 1999, 4:54 PM > You know, Bruce, I am sharing an ancient, and much beloved Nondual Realization that has been presented in marvelous scriptures and by some of the world's greatest Sages such Abhinavagupta, Ksemaraja and Swami Lakshmanjoo Maharaj. I find it absolutely amazing that you could be so utterly close-minded and unenlightened as to cast negative aspersion on my own capacity to experience truth and my capacity to communicate that truth. Not once in this Satsangh have I EVER characterized Ramana Maharshi or Shankara in a pejorative light. Critiqued, yes. Argued loopholes, yes. But, NEVER, have I condemned or made fun of another member's hearfelt convictions regarding the matter of their faith in their system of belief/realization. In fact, the opposite has occured. I have supported MANY members of this list in their expressions of Realization without regard to my own Experiences. Am I demanding when it comes to reading ill-thought out arguments and unjustified criticsms? Yes, absolutely. But have I ever characterized any person on this list as being spiritually inept in any way? No. AND, my arguments and viewpoints are nearly ALWAYS qualified by the fact that they are MY OWN perspective. I challenge you, friend Bruce, to examine the archives and see that this is nearly always so. Even in our recent exchange, sir, on not one occasion did I critique ANYTHING other than the quality of your arguments, NEVER your spiritual nature. Bruce, get off your high horse. Advaita Vedanta and Vedantic Jnana possess no corner on the Experience of Truth. If you would like to offer intelligent, insightful comments on Shaiva Nondualism, or my quality of presentation of Nondualism, then please do so. If, however, your behavior can conceive of nothing better to occupy itself than shallow, disrespectul sarcasm directed at my careful and experience-guided presentation of Nondual Self-Realization, then I must seriously question the quality of your commitment to Truth and Spirituality. Madhya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 11, 1999 Report Share Posted June 11, 1999 Madhya Nandi wrote: > "Madhya Nandi" <madhya > > ---------- > >Bruce Morgen <editor > > > > JnanaBanana.... > >Thu, Jun 10, 1999, 4:54 PM > > > > You know, Bruce, I am sharing an ancient, and much beloved Nondual > Realization that has been presented in marvelous scriptures and by some of > the world's greatest Sages such Abhinavagupta, Ksemaraja and Swami > Lakshmanjoo Maharaj. I find it absolutely amazing that you could be so > utterly close-minded and unenlightened as to cast negative aspersion on my > own capacity to experience truth and my capacity to communicate that truth. > > Not once in this Satsangh have I EVER characterized Ramana Maharshi or > Shankara in a pejorative light. Critiqued, yes. Argued loopholes, yes. > But, NEVER, have I condemned or made fun of another member's hearfelt > convictions regarding the matter of their faith in their system of > belief/realization. In fact, the opposite has occured. I have supported > MANY members of this list in their expressions of Realization without regard > to my own Experiences. > > Am I demanding when it comes to reading ill-thought out arguments and > unjustified criticsms? Yes, absolutely. But have I ever characterized any > person on this list as being spiritually inept in any way? No. AND, my > arguments and viewpoints are nearly ALWAYS qualified by the fact that they > are MY OWN perspective. I challenge you, friend Bruce, to examine the > archives and see that this is nearly always so. Even in our recent > exchange, sir, on not one occasion did I critique ANYTHING other than the > quality of your arguments, NEVER your spiritual nature. > > Bruce, get off your high horse. Advaita Vedanta and Vedantic Jnana possess > no corner on the Experience of Truth. > > If you would like to offer intelligent, insightful comments on Shaiva > Nondualism, or my quality of presentation of Nondualism, then please do so. > If, however, your behavior can conceive of nothing better to occupy itself > than shallow, disrespectul sarcasm directed at my careful and > experience-guided presentation of Nondual Self-Realization, then I must > seriously question the quality of your commitment to Truth and Spirituality. > > Madhya > Hello Madhya. Perhaps I am dense or have missed a post or something. If so, forgive me. I do not believe Bruce was trying to make fun of you in his JnanaBanana post. We have to relax a bit and carefully examine what is going on here. It seems to me that you are viewing Advaita Vedanta as an adversary of Advaita Shiva. The great Sages in both these traditions have not seen each other as adversaries but have respected each other. The 64 Shaiva saints were favorites of Ramana Maharshi as a young boy before his Realization. He often told stories of the Shaiva saints and choked up with emotion as he told them. Perhaps you are not aware, but there are people on this list who have spend most of their life in contemplation, meditation, enquiry, yoga, etc. There is no need for anyone to question the quality of someone's commitment to Truth and Spirituality. This is a satsangha. People are here because they wish to be in fellowship. Being in a group as diverse as this, we need to respect differing ways of expressing views. And let us not be oversensitive. What do we have to gain or lose? I am about to go to bed. Let us just take it easy with each other. Please. Harsha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 11, 1999 Report Share Posted June 11, 1999 On Thu, 10 Jun 1999 19:53:58 -0700 "Madhya Nandi" <madhya writes: >"Madhya Nandi" <madhya >---------- >>Bruce Morgen <editor >> >> JnanaBanana.... >>Thu, Jun 10, 1999, 4:54 PM >> >You know, Bruce, I am sharing an ancient, and much beloved Nondual >Realization that has been presented in marvelous scriptures and by >some of >the world's greatest Sages such Abhinavagupta, Ksemaraja and Swami >Lakshmanjoo Maharaj. I find it absolutely amazing that you could be >so >utterly close-minded and unenlightened as to cast negative aspersion >on my >own capacity to experience truth and my capacity to communicate that >truth. > Madhyaji, the only appropriate response to such a bevy of assertions is silence, in order that your own words may speak unimpeded and uninterpreted for themselves. >Not once in this Satsangh have I EVER characterized Ramana Maharshi >or >Shankara in a pejorative light. Critiqued, yes. Argued loopholes, >yes. >But, NEVER, have I condemned or made fun of another member's hearfelt >convictions regarding the matter of their faith in their system of >belief/realization. In fact, the opposite has occured. I have >supported >MANY members of this list in their expressions of Realization without >regard to my own Experiences. > I'm sure this is true and I do not in any way contend otherwise. >Am I demanding when it comes to reading ill-thought out arguments and >unjustified criticsms? Yes, absolutely. But have I ever >characterized any >person on this list as being spiritually inept in any way? No. AND, >my >arguments and viewpoints are nearly ALWAYS qualified by the fact that >they >are MY OWN perspective. I challenge you, friend Bruce, to examine >the >archives and see that this is nearly always so. Even in our recent >exchange, sir, on not one occasion did I critique ANYTHING other than >the quality of your arguments, NEVER your spiritual nature. > Others can characterize "spiritual nature," yours or anyone else's, I have not and will not do so. I do recall my observation regarding you and the jnana approach in a previous dialogue-- as I remember, *you* used the term "jnana-impaired" to capsulize that observation -- as being of your own, self-admitted lack of an attraction or "propensity" for the very particular approach of jnana yoga. This in no way implies an actual impairment in the sense of a defect or shortcoming, if indeed there is any such thing. >Bruce, get off your high horse. My sandaled feet rest on threadbare red carpeting. >Advaita Vedanta and Vedantic Jnana >possess no corner on the Experience of Truth. > I couldn't agree more and have never asserted otherwise. >If you would like to offer intelligent, insightful comments on Shaiva >Nondualism, or my quality of presentation of Nondualism, then please >do so. Thank you for the invitation, I see your discourse and presence as speaking quite effectively for themselves with no further comment from here. >If, however, your behavior can conceive of nothing better to occupy >itself than shallow, disrespectul sarcasm directed at my careful and >experience-guided presentation of Nondual Self-Realization, With all due respect, Madhyaji, do you actually see my whimsical "JnanaBanana" posting as having anything to do with you or your activity? I admit to being inspired by the clever subject line of your post "JnanaMe," but that is my post's only and very offhanded relation to you or your obviously "careful and experience- guided" expression. I sincerely regret that you inferred anything beyond that, it was certainly neither intended nor implied in my whimsy. >then I >must seriously question the quality of your commitment to Truth and >Spirituality. > You are more than welcome to do so, on whatever basis and via any means you see as appropriate. http://www.users.uniserve.com/~samuel/brucemrg.htm http://www.users.uniserve.com/~samuel/brucsong.htm m(_ _)m _ _________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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