Secret Shame ...

[Guest guest]

The following was written by my partner, Fiona, as part of her own remembering

process ... and fits in with what i have said in many of my last posts to this

list ...

 

 

Secret shame

 

My whole life spent trying to gain approval of others and get 'forgiveness' for

my secrets to ease my shame. So many years - so much energy has gone into

hiding the shameful secrets of my life, feeling absolutely split down my centre,

knowing I wasn't being true to my essence.

The shame . put upon me by Mother -- that I was a girl - not in the mould that

she wanted.

 

The spiritual quest for enlightenment is not about becoming 'enlightened'. I

already am. It is about unburdening my 'secret' onto anyone who I think: a)

will listen, b) might have an answer and c) couldn't really see me anyway. If

I thought, for one minute, that they knew my secret - the shame I carry - I'd

run away.

 

The secret shame of my very conception when I went totally unacknowledged by my

Mother's mind for many months. The secret knowing that was impregnated in the

foetus - Mother didn't acknowledge the embryonic me so I wasn't really wanted

and coming into the body was not a good or safe place to be.

 

So began my search for someone, anyone, to approve and acknowledge the embryonic

me -because that's where I got frozen in a state of shock. Anything that has

come after has simply layered more shame/guilt/grief upon the initial shock of

realizing that having chosen to re-incarnate, chosen my parents, that even

though it was my choice -- Mother didn't really want me in her body, she could

have miscarried me. Mother had the power of life and death over my embryonic

state. She could have killed my body. This is my secret.

 

I wear the scars of my mother's shame - because on some unconscious level she

knew. She knew I was in her body but she couldn't or wouldn't acknowledge me.

She knew she carried a life in her body but the idea was abhorrent to her

upbringing.

 

She denied she had a body - as I have denied. Her shame of her body became my

shame.

 

My 'secret' is a universal secret. The one everyone knows on some level but

never talk about .

 

Part of me has become my judge and jury, my own worst enemy, constantly judging

that I could never, ever be good enough.

The secret I carry is -- that my Mother's body didn't want me inside her .

 

I searched the spiritual pathways trying to gain an understanding of why/how the

sacredness of my life could have become so distorted, how my body and my

beingness could be so abhorrent to my own Mother. When I knocked on the door of

the Church - I got my answers. Control of the mind and not allowing the

body/unconscious to shed its 'secrets' has become a learned behaviour ..

 

The biggest secret, the greatest irony, is that my essence is untouchable, but

the shadow, the shame, inherited through the DNA had become the impenetrable

embryonic sac, which up until now, the waters had never broken through. My

'birth' has been delayed for way too long .

 

Up until . yesterday, when a little boy, without words, but simply through the

expression of his being, said come and play. Come and play with the innocent.

I see the reflection .

 

I honour the gift.

 

with respect

 

Fiona

 

Hobart Tasmania

fiona

 

"The Plain Man's Spiritual Notebook"

http://www.anunda.com/anunda.htm

 

//anunda

'anunda list' Public Archive:

/viewarchive.cgi?listname=anunda

__________________

[Guest guest]

I just don't see it this way. What I call what is below is the

"drama" of our lives. We have to create a big drama to keep

it all personal in some way or another. The real drama is that

all that personal stuff is "nothing" at all.

 

There aren't any secrets and there isn't any shame. That is all

a big ruse to keep the focus on the little self. The sun going round

the earth. Wake up. :-)

 

"When I was a child I spoke as a child.......

Now that I am a man it is time to put childish things away......

Then I saw as through a glass darkly.....

Now I see face to face and I know even as I am known....."

 

(I had to quote from memory....my children have stolen my

bible. <s>)

 

Marcia

 

 

Christopher Wynter wrote:

> "Christopher Wynter" <wynter

>

> The following was written by my partner, Fiona, as part of her own remembering

> process ... and fits in with what i have said in many of my last posts to this

> list ...

>

> Secret shame

>

> My whole life spent trying to gain approval of others and get 'forgiveness'

for

> my secrets to ease my shame. So many years - so much energy has gone into

> hiding the shameful secrets of my life, feeling absolutely split down my

centre,

> knowing I wasn't being true to my essence.

> The shame . put upon me by Mother -- that I was a girl - not in the mould

that

> she wanted.

>

> The spiritual quest for enlightenment is not about becoming 'enlightened'. I

> already am. It is about unburdening my 'secret' onto anyone who I think: a)

> will listen, b) might have an answer and c) couldn't really see me anyway.

If

> I thought, for one minute, that they knew my secret - the shame I carry - I'd

> run away.

>

> The secret shame of my very conception when I went totally unacknowledged by

my

> Mother's mind for many months. The secret knowing that was impregnated in the

> foetus - Mother didn't acknowledge the embryonic me so I wasn't really wanted

> and coming into the body was not a good or safe place to be.

>

> So began my search for someone, anyone, to approve and acknowledge the

embryonic

> me -because that's where I got frozen in a state of shock. Anything that has

> come after has simply layered more shame/guilt/grief upon the initial shock of

> realizing that having chosen to re-incarnate, chosen my parents, that even

> though it was my choice -- Mother didn't really want me in her body, she could

> have miscarried me. Mother had the power of life and death over my embryonic

> state. She could have killed my body. This is my secret.

>

> I wear the scars of my mother's shame - because on some unconscious level she

> knew. She knew I was in her body but she couldn't or wouldn't acknowledge me.

> She knew she carried a life in her body but the idea was abhorrent to her

> upbringing.

>

> She denied she had a body - as I have denied. Her shame of her body became my

> shame.

>

> My 'secret' is a universal secret. The one everyone knows on some level but

> never talk about .

>

> Part of me has become my judge and jury, my own worst enemy, constantly

judging

> that I could never, ever be good enough.

> The secret I carry is -- that my Mother's body didn't want me inside her .

>

> I searched the spiritual pathways trying to gain an understanding of why/how

the

> sacredness of my life could have become so distorted, how my body and my

> beingness could be so abhorrent to my own Mother. When I knocked on the door

of

> the Church - I got my answers. Control of the mind and not allowing the

> body/unconscious to shed its 'secrets' has become a learned behaviour ..

>

> The biggest secret, the greatest irony, is that my essence is untouchable, but

> the shadow, the shame, inherited through the DNA had become the impenetrable

> embryonic sac, which up until now, the waters had never broken through. My

> 'birth' has been delayed for way too long .

>

> Up until . yesterday, when a little boy, without words, but simply through the

> expression of his being, said come and play. Come and play with the innocent.

> I see the reflection .

>

> I honour the gift.

>

> with respect

>

> Fiona

>

> Hobart Tasmania

> fiona

>

> "The Plain Man's Spiritual Notebook"

> http://www.anunda.com/anunda.htm

>

> //anunda

> 'anunda list' Public Archive:

> /viewarchive.cgi?listname=anunda

> __________________

>

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[Guest guest]

Hi Marcia,

>I just don't see it this way. What I call what is below is the

>"drama" of our lives. We have to create a big drama to keep

>it all personal in some way or another. The real drama is that

>all that personal stuff is "nothing" at all.

>

>There aren't any secrets and there isn't any shame. That is all

>a big ruse to keep the focus on the little self. The sun going round

>the earth. Wake up. :-)

 

My friend Lynea teaches a weekend workshop that is mostly on how to find

LDs (Limiting Decisions) and clear them. They are what the TA people would

call "scripting," part of the unconscious script of one's life. She says

they can come from very early, even in the womb, and they are held even in

the cells of the body. She writes that the purpose of the workshop is

>...to teach you how to uncover limiting decisions and emotional imprints,

>erase them from your cellular patterns and unfold your hidden potential.

>

>Limiting Decisions are hidden imprints within our cellular memory that

>cause our life to be the way we are experiencing it when it is NOT what we

>want our life or ourselves to be like. They are the unknown written script

>of our life.

>

>Whatever you are experiencing in your life that is not what your heart

>wants is a limiting decision. For instance, you are a peace-loving person

>who works very hard, but still wealth eludes you. You find an L.D.:

>"Money causes fights, and since you want harmony, you must avoid money."

>

>Whenever you are in an emotional state not to your liking, you have a

>limiting decision. For example, you are upset with yourself for eating

>too much. You find an L.D.: "lt pleases Daddy when I clean my plate. "

>

>When you can't manifest what you desire, no matter how hard you try, you

>have a limiting decision (also called a violet light issue). For example,

>you are a teacher, and no matter how much you exercise, eat "right" & work

>for a youthful appearance, you continue to age faster than those around

>you. You find an L.D.: "To be accepted as wise, you must look old."

>

>Limiting decisions come from genetic memory (past lives or inherited in

>DNA), in the womb (from mother and/or own observations), early childhood,

>amd mass consciousness (collective thought forms).

 

I've taken the workshop several times and qualified as a teacher. I can

tell you these limiting decisions are very real... and when people aren't

aware of them, they don't now why they are doing certain things... or not

doing them... and they don't know how to change.

 

Fiona has uncovered a number of LDs that she has held since she was in the

womb, such as:

>> The secret shame of my very conception when I went totally

>>unacknowledged by my

>> Mother's mind for many months. The secret knowing that was impregnated

>>in the

>> foetus - Mother didn't acknowledge the embryonic me so I wasn't really

>>wanted

>> and coming into the body was not a good or safe place to be.

 

LD: "Living in a body isn't good or safe."

>> So began my search for someone, anyone, to approve and acknowledge the

>>embryonic

>> me -because that's where I got frozen in a state of shock. -snip- Mother

>>didn't really want me in her body, -snip-

 

LD: "I wasn't wanted, and I shouldn't be here."

>>....on some unconscious level she

>> knew. She knew I was in her body but she couldn't or wouldn't

>>acknowledge me.

>> She knew she carried a life in her body but the idea was abhorrent to her

>> upbringing.

>>

>> She denied she had a body - as I have denied. Her shame of her body

>>became my

>> shame.

 

LD: "Living in a body is shameful."

>> Part of me has become my judge and jury, my own worst enemy, constantly

>>judging

>> that I could never, ever be good enough.

>> The secret I carry is -- that my Mother's body didn't want me inside her .

 

LD: "Since Mother didn't want me at all, I can never be good enough for her

to love me."

 

This is my statement of some LDs... Fiona could probably do it better.

 

How to get rid of them? Once Lynea - or a person doing this for herself -

uncovers some LDs, she asks the body/subconscious, "Is the body willing to

balance out these issues & still allow you/me to have all the things in

life that are important to you/me?" If the answer is NO, it means there's

something more to find out before clearing. If it's YES, then we use the

violet light to clear the LDs from every cell of the body... and white

light to fill all the holes.

 

I have seen incredible change in people from this work. When I went to my

first workshop, I was sick with a chronic, incurable illness: CFS/ME. When

I left at the end of the last session, I was in good health.

 

Love,

Dharma

[Guest guest]

Hi Dharma,

 

I think we are saying the same thing really. A limiting decision

is the drama. We have these limiting decisions and then we

begin to believe that they are real and not decisions that we

have made. We identify (give it our identity) with the decision

and make it real. Then we work on clearing it out as if it were

real in the first place. All I am suggesting is that the entire process

might be easier if we did not believe the "story" in the first place.

I think it might be a matter of perspective. It just seems like more

melodrama than is needed if you label it such things like secrets

and shame. These are laden with heaviness and gravity. I guess I

am suggesting moving it over to the side of a universal dilemma

rather than a personal one. You know like saying...."Oh there goes

Marcia doing her fussing thing." rather than "Marcia has a deep

sorrow from her time in the womb." Make any sense?

 

Marcia

 

Dharma wrote:

> Dharma <fisher1

>

> Hi Marcia,

>

> >I just don't see it this way. What I call what is below is the

> >"drama" of our lives. We have to create a big drama to keep

> >it all personal in some way or another. The real drama is that

> >all that personal stuff is "nothing" at all.

> >

> >There aren't any secrets and there isn't any shame. That is all

> >a big ruse to keep the focus on the little self. The sun going round

> >the earth. Wake up. :-)

>

> My friend Lynea teaches a weekend workshop that is mostly on how to find

> LDs (Limiting Decisions) and clear them. They are what the TA people would

> call "scripting," part of the unconscious script of one's life. She says

> they can come from very early, even in the womb, and they are held even in

> the cells of the body. She writes that the purpose of the workshop is

>

> >...to teach you how to uncover limiting decisions and emotional imprints,

> >erase them from your cellular patterns and unfold your hidden potential.

> >

> >Limiting Decisions are hidden imprints within our cellular memory that

> >cause our life to be the way we are experiencing it when it is NOT what we

> >want our life or ourselves to be like. They are the unknown written script

> >of our life.

> >

> >Whatever you are experiencing in your life that is not what your heart

> >wants is a limiting decision. For instance, you are a peace-loving person

> >who works very hard, but still wealth eludes you. You find an L.D.:

> >"Money causes fights, and since you want harmony, you must avoid money."

> >

> >Whenever you are in an emotional state not to your liking, you have a

> >limiting decision. For example, you are upset with yourself for eating

> >too much. You find an L.D.: "lt pleases Daddy when I clean my plate. "

> >

> >When you can't manifest what you desire, no matter how hard you try, you

> >have a limiting decision (also called a violet light issue). For example,

> >you are a teacher, and no matter how much you exercise, eat "right" & work

> >for a youthful appearance, you continue to age faster than those around

> >you. You find an L.D.: "To be accepted as wise, you must look old."

> >

> >Limiting decisions come from genetic memory (past lives or inherited in

> >DNA), in the womb (from mother and/or own observations), early childhood,

> >amd mass consciousness (collective thought forms).

>

> I've taken the workshop several times and qualified as a teacher. I can

> tell you these limiting decisions are very real... and when people aren't

> aware of them, they don't now why they are doing certain things... or not

> doing them... and they don't know how to change.

>

> Fiona has uncovered a number of LDs that she has held since she was in the

> womb, such as:

>

> >> The secret shame of my very conception when I went totally

> >>unacknowledged by my

> >> Mother's mind for many months. The secret knowing that was impregnated

> >>in the

> >> foetus - Mother didn't acknowledge the embryonic me so I wasn't really

> >>wanted

> >> and coming into the body was not a good or safe place to be.

>

> LD: "Living in a body isn't good or safe."

>

> >> So began my search for someone, anyone, to approve and acknowledge the

> >>embryonic

> >> me -because that's where I got frozen in a state of shock. -snip- Mother

> >>didn't really want me in her body, -snip-

>

> LD: "I wasn't wanted, and I shouldn't be here."

>

> >>....on some unconscious level she

> >> knew. She knew I was in her body but she couldn't or wouldn't

> >>acknowledge me.

> >> She knew she carried a life in her body but the idea was abhorrent to her

> >> upbringing.

> >>

> >> She denied she had a body - as I have denied. Her shame of her body

> >>became my

> >> shame.

>

> LD: "Living in a body is shameful."

>

> >> Part of me has become my judge and jury, my own worst enemy, constantly

> >>judging

> >> that I could never, ever be good enough.

> >> The secret I carry is -- that my Mother's body didn't want me inside her .

>

> LD: "Since Mother didn't want me at all, I can never be good enough for her

> to love me."

>

> This is my statement of some LDs... Fiona could probably do it better.

>

> How to get rid of them? Once Lynea - or a person doing this for herself -

> uncovers some LDs, she asks the body/subconscious, "Is the body willing to

> balance out these issues & still allow you/me to have all the things in

> life that are important to you/me?" If the answer is NO, it means there's

> something more to find out before clearing. If it's YES, then we use the

> violet light to clear the LDs from every cell of the body... and white

> light to fill all the holes.

>

> I have seen incredible change in people from this work. When I went to my

> first workshop, I was sick with a chronic, incurable illness: CFS/ME. When

> I left at the end of the last session, I was in good health.

>

> Love,

> Dharma

>

> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------

>

> Congrats to our GROW TO GIVE winners, ZENtertainment & ROTInews!

>

> Check out ONElist's latest program, FRIENDS & FAMILY. See homepage.

>

> ------

> Eat Raw Foods and You Will Never be Constipated!

[Guest guest]

It is the limiting decision (passed down the genetic line) that sees us not able

to accept the truth of ourselves and has us out searching for what we already

are ...

 

There is a big difference between intellectual spirituality and the spirituality

when it is made real in the body ...

 

when it is real in the body, everything that is said and done is in honour and

respect of the self ... and it is done without the mind having to think

(consciously or unconsciously) about it ...

 

K releases (amongst other things) the limiting decisions ... and a lot of

people, when faced with them, can wallow in those decisions without recognising

that they are past decisions comin up for release ...

 

This is about taking Harsha's Satsangh and making it real in the physical body

so that you don't have to 'learn' anything ... or 'do' anything ...

 

Until the realisation of the nature of the True Self is real in the physical

body, there will always be reaction to the words written from the physical body

of another ...

 

Christopher Wynter

 

 

-

Marcia Paul <jacpa

< >

Thursday, 12 August 1999 9:53

Re: Secret Shame ...

 

> Marcia Paul <jacpa

>

> Hi Dharma,

>

> I think we are saying the same thing really. A limiting decision

> is the drama. We have these limiting decisions and then we

> begin to believe that they are real and not decisions that we

> have made. We identify (give it our identity) with the decision

> and make it real. Then we work on clearing it out as if it were

> real in the first place. All I am suggesting is that the entire process

> might be easier if we did not believe the "story" in the first place.

> I think it might be a matter of perspective. It just seems like more

> melodrama than is needed if you label it such things like secrets

> and shame. These are laden with heaviness and gravity. I guess I

> am suggesting moving it over to the side of a universal dilemma

> rather than a personal one. You know like saying...."Oh there goes

> Marcia doing her fussing thing." rather than "Marcia has a deep

> sorrow from her time in the womb." Make any sense?

>

> Marcia

>

> Dharma wrote:

>

> > Dharma <fisher1

> >

> > Hi Marcia,

> >

> > >I just don't see it this way. What I call what is below is the

> > >"drama" of our lives. We have to create a big drama to keep

> > >it all personal in some way or another. The real drama is that

> > >all that personal stuff is "nothing" at all.

> > >

> > >There aren't any secrets and there isn't any shame. That is all

> > >a big ruse to keep the focus on the little self. The sun going round

> > >the earth. Wake up. :-)

> >

> > My friend Lynea teaches a weekend workshop that is mostly on how to find

> > LDs (Limiting Decisions) and clear them. They are what the TA people would

> > call "scripting," part of the unconscious script of one's life. She says

> > they can come from very early, even in the womb, and they are held even in

> > the cells of the body. She writes that the purpose of the workshop is

> >

> > >...to teach you how to uncover limiting decisions and emotional imprints,

> > >erase them from your cellular patterns and unfold your hidden potential.

> > >

> > >Limiting Decisions are hidden imprints within our cellular memory that

> > >cause our life to be the way we are experiencing it when it is NOT what we

> > >want our life or ourselves to be like. They are the unknown written script

> > >of our life.

> > >

> > >Whatever you are experiencing in your life that is not what your heart

> > >wants is a limiting decision. For instance, you are a peace-loving person

> > >who works very hard, but still wealth eludes you. You find an L.D.:

> > >"Money causes fights, and since you want harmony, you must avoid money."

> > >

> > >Whenever you are in an emotional state not to your liking, you have a

> > >limiting decision. For example, you are upset with yourself for eating

> > >too much. You find an L.D.: "lt pleases Daddy when I clean my plate. "

> > >

> > >When you can't manifest what you desire, no matter how hard you try, you

> > >have a limiting decision (also called a violet light issue). For example,

> > >you are a teacher, and no matter how much you exercise, eat

"right" & work

> > >for a youthful appearance, you continue to age faster than those around

> > >you. You find an L.D.: "To be accepted as wise, you must look old."

> > >

> > >Limiting decisions come from genetic memory (past lives or inherited in

> > >DNA), in the womb (from mother and/or own observations), early childhood,

> > >amd mass consciousness (collective thought forms).

> >

> > I've taken the workshop several times and qualified as a teacher. I can

> > tell you these limiting decisions are very real... and when people aren't

> > aware of them, they don't now why they are doing certain things... or not

> > doing them... and they don't know how to change.

> >

> > Fiona has uncovered a number of LDs that she has held since she was in the

> > womb, such as:

> >

> > >> The secret shame of my very conception when I went totally

> > >>unacknowledged by my

> > >> Mother's mind for many months. The secret knowing that was impregnated

> > >>in the

> > >> foetus - Mother didn't acknowledge the embryonic me so I wasn't really

> > >>wanted

> > >> and coming into the body was not a good or safe place to be.

> >

> > LD: "Living in a body isn't good or safe."

> >

> > >> So began my search for someone, anyone, to approve and acknowledge the

> > >>embryonic

> > >> me -because that's where I got frozen in a state of shock. -snip- Mother

> > >>didn't really want me in her body, -snip-

> >

> > LD: "I wasn't wanted, and I shouldn't be here."

> >

> > >>....on some unconscious level she

> > >> knew. She knew I was in her body but she couldn't or wouldn't

> > >>acknowledge me.

> > >> She knew she carried a life in her body but the idea was abhorrent to her

> > >> upbringing.

> > >>

> > >> She denied she had a body - as I have denied. Her shame of her body

> > >>became my

> > >> shame.

> >

> > LD: "Living in a body is shameful."

> >

> > >> Part of me has become my judge and jury, my own worst enemy, constantly

> > >>judging

> > >> that I could never, ever be good enough.

> > >> The secret I carry is -- that my Mother's body didn't want me inside her

..

> >

> > LD: "Since Mother didn't want me at all, I can never be good enough for her

> > to love me."

> >

> > This is my statement of some LDs... Fiona could probably do it better.

> >

> > How to get rid of them? Once Lynea - or a person doing this for herself -

> > uncovers some LDs, she asks the body/subconscious, "Is the body willing to

> > balance out these issues & still allow you/me to have all the things in

> > life that are important to you/me?" If the answer is NO, it means there's

> > something more to find out before clearing. If it's YES, then we use the

> > violet light to clear the LDs from every cell of the body... and white

> > light to fill all the holes.

> >

> > I have seen incredible change in people from this work. When I went to my

> > first workshop, I was sick with a chronic, incurable illness: CFS/ME. When

> > I left at the end of the last session, I was in good health.

> >

> > Love,

> > Dharma

> >

> > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------

> >

> > Congrats to our GROW TO GIVE winners, ZENtertainment & ROTInews!

> >

> > Check out ONElist's latest program, FRIENDS & FAMILY. See homepage.

> >

> > ------

> > Eat Raw Foods and You Will Never be Constipated!

>

>

>

>

> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------

>

> Show your ONElist SPIRIT!

> /store/tshirts.html

> With a new ONElist SHIRT available through our website.

>

> ------

> Eat Raw Foods and You Will Never be Constipated!

[Guest guest]

Hi Marcia,

>

>I think we are saying the same thing really. A limiting decision

>is the drama. We have these limiting decisions and then we

>begin to believe that they are real and not decisions that we

>have made.

 

I don't think you understood what I was saying. We're talking about

unconscious stuff... that means the conscious mind is unaware of it. You

don't believe anything about it, because you don't even know it exists.

 

What we do know is that someone has a problem. Or it might even be someone

wanting to clean up her karmic stuff and unconscious blocks even without

thinking there's a problem. There are ways to find these things... to

bring them out of the unconscious.

> We identify (give it our identity) with the decision

>and make it real. Then we work on clearing it out as if it were

>real in the first place. All I am suggesting is that the entire process

>might be easier if we did not believe the "story" in the first place.

>I think it might be a matter of perspective. It just seems like more

>melodrama than is needed if you label it such things like secrets

>and shame.

 

Nobody labeled this... it was discovered, see? It was there! "Secret"

and "shame" are words that come from Fiona... from her unconscious stuff.

They might not apply to the next person... it might be something entirely

different.

> These are laden with heaviness and gravity. I guess I

>am suggesting moving it over to the side of a universal dilemma

>rather than a personal one. You know like saying...."Oh there goes

>Marcia doing her fussing thing." rather than "Marcia has a deep

>sorrow from her time in the womb." Make any sense?

 

No, Marcia. This is not stuff we think of in one way or another... or

believe or don't believe... or exaggerate or don't exaggerate. It's stuff

that we don't even know about... until it's discovered by one of these

methods... Whatever is unconscious is NOT conscious... by definition and

in fact.

 

Love,

Dharma

[Guest guest]

Hi Christopher,

 

I think there is a difference between waking up and Kundalini.

You can wake up without the K experience or you can have

the K experience without waking up. I think it makes a big

difference which comes first. If you have some intellectual

appreciation already of some of your habitual patterned ways

of thinking, which by the way are in the entire body, then the

K experience is not quite so dramatic.

 

I agree wholeheartedly that the body is essential. It is in and

through and with the body that I AM. I understood alot of

things but until I got in touch with my body there was not

the energy available for transformation.

 

Make sense?

 

After realization of the True Self there will still be reaction

of the words written from one physical body to another. :-)

 

 

Christopher Wynter wrote:

> "Christopher Wynter" <wynter

>

> It is the limiting decision (passed down the genetic line) that sees us not

able

> to accept the truth of ourselves and has us out searching for what we already

> are ...

>

> There is a big difference between intellectual spirituality and the

spirituality

> when it is made real in the body ...

>

> when it is real in the body, everything that is said and done is in honour and

> respect of the self ... and it is done without the mind having to think

> (consciously or unconsciously) about it ...

>

> K releases (amongst other things) the limiting decisions ... and a lot of

> people, when faced with them, can wallow in those decisions without

recognising

> that they are past decisions comin up for release ...

>

> This is about taking Harsha's Satsangh and making it real in the physical body

> so that you don't have to 'learn' anything ... or 'do' anything ...

>

> Until the realisation of the nature of the True Self is real in the physical

> body, there will always be reaction to the words written from the physical

body

> of another ...

>

> Christopher Wynter

>

> -

> Marcia Paul <jacpa

> < >

> Thursday, 12 August 1999 9:53

> Re: Secret Shame ...

>

> > Marcia Paul <jacpa

> >

> > Hi Dharma,

> >

> > I think we are saying the same thing really. A limiting decision

> > is the drama. We have these limiting decisions and then we

> > begin to believe that they are real and not decisions that we

> > have made. We identify (give it our identity) with the decision

> > and make it real. Then we work on clearing it out as if it were

> > real in the first place. All I am suggesting is that the entire process

> > might be easier if we did not believe the "story" in the first place.

> > I think it might be a matter of perspective. It just seems like more

> > melodrama than is needed if you label it such things like secrets

> > and shame. These are laden with heaviness and gravity. I guess I

> > am suggesting moving it over to the side of a universal dilemma

> > rather than a personal one. You know like saying...."Oh there goes

> > Marcia doing her fussing thing." rather than "Marcia has a deep

> > sorrow from her time in the womb." Make any sense?

> >

> > Marcia

> >

> > Dharma wrote:

> >

> > > Dharma <fisher1

> > >

> > > Hi Marcia,

> > >

> > > >I just don't see it this way. What I call what is below is the

> > > >"drama" of our lives. We have to create a big drama to keep

> > > >it all personal in some way or another. The real drama is that

> > > >all that personal stuff is "nothing" at all.

> > > >

> > > >There aren't any secrets and there isn't any shame. That is all

> > > >a big ruse to keep the focus on the little self. The sun going round

> > > >the earth. Wake up. :-)

> > >

> > > My friend Lynea teaches a weekend workshop that is mostly on how to find

> > > LDs (Limiting Decisions) and clear them. They are what the TA people

would

> > > call "scripting," part of the unconscious script of one's life. She says

> > > they can come from very early, even in the womb, and they are held even in

> > > the cells of the body. She writes that the purpose of the workshop is

> > >

> > > >...to teach you how to uncover limiting decisions and emotional imprints,

> > > >erase them from your cellular patterns and unfold your hidden potential.

> > > >

> > > >Limiting Decisions are hidden imprints within our cellular memory that

> > > >cause our life to be the way we are experiencing it when it is NOT what

we

> > > >want our life or ourselves to be like. They are the unknown written

script

> > > >of our life.

> > > >

> > > >Whatever you are experiencing in your life that is not what your heart

> > > >wants is a limiting decision. For instance, you are a peace-loving

person

> > > >who works very hard, but still wealth eludes you. You find an L.D.:

> > > >"Money causes fights, and since you want harmony, you must

avoid money."

> > > >

> > > >Whenever you are in an emotional state not to your liking, you have a

> > > >limiting decision. For example, you are upset with yourself for eating

> > > >too much. You find an L.D.: "lt pleases Daddy when I clean my plate. "

> > > >

> > > >When you can't manifest what you desire, no matter how hard you try, you

> > > >have a limiting decision (also called a violet light issue). For

example,

> > > >you are a teacher, and no matter how much you exercise, eat

"right" &

work

> > > >for a youthful appearance, you continue to age faster than those around

> > > >you. You find an L.D.: "To be accepted as wise, you must look old."

> > > >

> > > >Limiting decisions come from genetic memory (past lives or inherited in

> > > >DNA), in the womb (from mother and/or own observations), early childhood,

> > > >amd mass consciousness (collective thought forms).

> > >

> > > I've taken the workshop several times and qualified as a teacher. I can

> > > tell you these limiting decisions are very real... and when people aren't

> > > aware of them, they don't now why they are doing certain things... or not

> > > doing them... and they don't know how to change.

> > >

> > > Fiona has uncovered a number of LDs that she has held since she was in the

> > > womb, such as:

> > >

> > > >> The secret shame of my very conception when I went totally

> > > >>unacknowledged by my

> > > >> Mother's mind for many months. The secret knowing that was impregnated

> > > >>in the

> > > >> foetus - Mother didn't acknowledge the embryonic me so I wasn't really

> > > >>wanted

> > > >> and coming into the body was not a good or safe place to be.

> > >

> > > LD: "Living in a body isn't good or safe."

> > >

> > > >> So began my search for someone, anyone, to approve and acknowledge the

> > > >>embryonic

> > > >> me -because that's where I got frozen in a state of shock. -snip-

Mother

> > > >>didn't really want me in her body, -snip-

> > >

> > > LD: "I wasn't wanted, and I shouldn't be here."

> > >

> > > >>....on some unconscious level she

> > > >> knew. She knew I was in her body but she couldn't or wouldn't

> > > >>acknowledge me.

> > > >> She knew she carried a life in her body but the idea was abhorrent to

her

> > > >> upbringing.

> > > >>

> > > >> She denied she had a body - as I have denied. Her shame of her body

> > > >>became my

> > > >> shame.

> > >

> > > LD: "Living in a body is shameful."

> > >

> > > >> Part of me has become my judge and jury, my own worst enemy, constantly

> > > >>judging

> > > >> that I could never, ever be good enough.

> > > >> The secret I carry is -- that my Mother's body didn't want me inside

her

> .

> > >

> > > LD: "Since Mother didn't want me at all, I can never be good enough for

her

> > > to love me."

> > >

> > > This is my statement of some LDs... Fiona could probably do it better.

> > >

> > > How to get rid of them? Once Lynea - or a person doing this for herself -

> > > uncovers some LDs, she asks the body/subconscious, "Is the body willing to

> > > balance out these issues & still allow you/me to have all the things in

> > > life that are important to you/me?" If the answer is NO, it means there's

> > > something more to find out before clearing. If it's YES, then we use the

> > > violet light to clear the LDs from every cell of the body... and white

> > > light to fill all the holes.

> > >

> > > I have seen incredible change in people from this work. When I went to my

> > > first workshop, I was sick with a chronic, incurable illness: CFS/ME.

When

> > > I left at the end of the last session, I was in good health.

> > >

> > > Love,

> > > Dharma

> > >

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[Guest guest]

Hi Dharma,

 

This conversation is getting interesting! I read this book

once called "The Myth of Mental Illness". I think it was

by Szaz or something like that. I think his postulation

was that there is no unconscious. While I do not

to that necessarily, I do think it is possible that we are

creating it as we go along.

 

I think it is perspective that we are talking about. I have

a template. In other words I know how I operate. I may

not be aware of everything in my unconscious but I know

many of the forms they take. I know my basic character

structure. I can sense in my body when I am acting out

of pattern and I can use that sensing as a wakeup call.

I don't have to go dig around and figure it all out again.

I can just use the energy of my unconscious reactions to

bring myself back to the present moment. In fact "if" I

try to dig around and figure it all out, I am still in the past

and not the present. Digging around trying to figure it

all out only perpetuates it. It is enough to know that

something from my past is intruding. Why do I have to

know all the nuances? Those are distractions from being

right here right now. You can't make insanity sane no

matter how hard you try. It is like looking for your keys

under the light and not where you lost them.

 

I went for a massage the other day. The lady was into

analysis as well as massage. She began to tell me that

she felt a great sorrow coming from me and that it

happened around my mother and probably around the

age of five. After the massage I came home and was

telling a friend about my sorrow. He said..."Of course.

Your aren't a four (enneagram type four...tragic romantic)

for nothing." At that moment I woke up. I had been

believing this great sorrow stuff. I was beginning to model

an entire "story" around my great sorrow. What a relief

that my friend was there to give me a shake.

 

Marcia

 

Dharma wrote:

> Dharma <fisher1

>

> Hi Marcia,

> >

> >I think we are saying the same thing really. A limiting decision

> >is the drama. We have these limiting decisions and then we

> >begin to believe that they are real and not decisions that we

> >have made.

>

> I don't think you understood what I was saying. We're talking about

> unconscious stuff... that means the conscious mind is unaware of it. You

> don't believe anything about it, because you don't even know it exists.

>

> What we do know is that someone has a problem. Or it might even be someone

> wanting to clean up her karmic stuff and unconscious blocks even without

> thinking there's a problem. There are ways to find these things... to

> bring them out of the unconscious.

>

> > We identify (give it our identity) with the decision

> >and make it real. Then we work on clearing it out as if it were

> >real in the first place. All I am suggesting is that the entire process

> >might be easier if we did not believe the "story" in the first place.

> >I think it might be a matter of perspective. It just seems like more

> >melodrama than is needed if you label it such things like secrets

> >and shame.

>

> Nobody labeled this... it was discovered, see? It was there! "Secret"

> and "shame" are words that come from Fiona... from her unconscious stuff.

> They might not apply to the next person... it might be something entirely

> different.

>

> > These are laden with heaviness and gravity. I guess I

> >am suggesting moving it over to the side of a universal dilemma

> >rather than a personal one. You know like saying...."Oh there goes

> >Marcia doing her fussing thing." rather than "Marcia has a deep

> >sorrow from her time in the womb." Make any sense?

>

> No, Marcia. This is not stuff we think of in one way or another... or

> believe or don't believe... or exaggerate or don't exaggerate. It's stuff

> that we don't even know about... until it's discovered by one of these

> methods... Whatever is unconscious is NOT conscious... by definition and

> in fact.

>

> Love,

> Dharma

>

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>

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>

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[Guest guest]

Hello Christopher,

 

Bowing to you in respect.

> It is the limiting decision (passed down the genetic line) that sees us not

able

> to accept the truth of ourselves and has us out searching for what we already

> are ...

 

Taking a framework, that of Shri Aurobindo in using words. In his works

he sees or talks about the genetic line as the physical ego or mind. The

"substance" that holds electrons, protons and all that stuff toguether.

A form of subconscious mind not accessible directly by the normal

anthropological mind developed by our culture and words.

> There is a big difference between intellectual spirituality and the

spirituality

> when it is made real in the body ...

 

In that sense, intellectual spirituality would be called simply "mind"

by him, and the concept of spirituality you seem to refer to, the

creation of the "super mind", to take his words. Like he writes:

 

" The original nature of the supermind is self conscience and all

conscience of the Infinite, of the universal Spirit and Self in things,

organising on the foundation and according to the character of self

knowledge its own wisdom and effective omnipotence for the unfolding and

the regulated action of the universe and of all things in the universe".

Chapter XX The intuitive mind, Part IV of "The synthesis of yoga"

> when it is real in the body, everything that is said and done is in honour and

> respect of the self ... and it is done without the mind having to think

> (consciously or unconsciously) about it ...

 

Yes... According to his words when we attain our "supra mental" nature.

In other words when the mind by the gradual work of the "intuitive mind"

open to the "super mind".

> K releases (amongst other things) the limiting decisions ... and a lot of

> people, when faced with them, can wallow in those decisions without

recognising

> that they are past decisions comin up for release ...

 

I would see in this perspective K as the the process that works the

mind, all the way deep to to the physical ego or mind to open also. So

that all that is left, in this process of transformation, is a unique

interface between the "genetic line" and the supermind. The interface of

the mind, or cultural mind transmitted over generations comes to be

completely inexistent. The physical ego may start to act in spontaneity,

more and more, to the super mind. The rainbow of the intuitive mind

between those two polarities is growing wider, in this evolutionary

process.

> This is about taking Harsha's Satsangh and making it real in the physical body

> so that you don't have to 'learn' anything ... or 'do' anything ...

>

> Until the realisation of the nature of the True Self is real in the physical

> body, there will always be reaction to the words written from the physical

body

> of another ...

 

Like in fractals:

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/konrad/bild4.jpg

(for those who don't know about them)

 

On may look at the body as one looks at a fratal image, you may zoom in

as much as you want, you will always find new patterns developing before

your eyes in the generated image. It's the magic of fractals.

 

It remains that it's the same "eye" all that time that is "looking" at

the "evolution" or "zooming in" of the pattern. As would say shri

aurobindo to his students before starting integral yoga, it's important

have "turned over" the eye before sinking in the deepness of the

physical ego to open it.

 

Jung did not though so,

 

All a matter of perspective, i guess.

 

Antoine

[Guest guest]

Whatever is unconscious is NOT conscious... by definition and

> in fact.

>

> Love,

> Dharma

 

So i guess what i called "I" in my experience is unconscious, guess i

will have to find another name for "I" if i want to be conscious

 

Antoine

[Guest guest]

Antoine:

 

I just joined this list, and I'm very happy to know

that other admirers of Sri Auribindo are present here.

 

Namaste,

 

-- Max

 

 

 

 

---------------------------

FREE - yourname - Just visit http://www.philosophers.net

[Guest guest]

Hi Marcia,

>I think there is a difference between waking up and Kundalini.

>You can wake up without the K experience or you can have

>the K experience without waking up. I think it makes a big

>difference which comes first. If you have some intellectual

>appreciation already of some of your habitual patterned ways

>of thinking, which by the way are in the entire body, then the

>K experience is not quite so dramatic.

 

I don't know... I went the Sky Path first... taught Raja Yoga for years,

and I was protecting my students against K. activation. But when mine went

into the physical... when my guide activated my K.... and 9 months later

it went into high gear... it was quite dramatic! ) But maybe you mean

something else... traumatic, painful??

>I agree wholeheartedly that the body is essential. It is in and

>through and with the body that I AM. I understood alot of

>things but until I got in touch with my body there was not

>the energy available for transformation.

 

Depends what kind of transformation you're after. Active K. is not

necessary to go into the All... to unite with Brahman, the Godhead...

 

Lynea's work... finding LDs and emotional problems and clearing them...

does not depend on anyone having active K.... and it is certainly

transformative!

 

Love,

Dharma

[Guest guest]

Hi Marcia,

>

>This conversation is getting interesting! I read this book

>once called "The Myth of Mental Illness". I think it was

>by Szaz or something like that. I think his postulation

>was that there is no unconscious. While I do not

>to that necessarily, I do think it is possible that we are

>creating it as we go along.

 

Well, maybe we can't even talk... if we have no terms in common. But if

there's no unconscious, then why, in what's below, do you keep talking

about your unconscious?

>I do think it is possible that we are

>>creating it as we go along.

 

More like creating the conscious as we go along, I think... That's the

tip of the iceberg... the singularity. Isn't that what the ego's for?

The "I-making" faculty?

>I think it is perspective that we are talking about. I have

>a template. In other words I know how I operate. I may

>not be aware of everything in my unconscious but I know

>many of the forms they take. I know my basic character

>structure. I can sense in my body when I am acting out

>of pattern and I can use that sensing as a wakeup call.

>I don't have to go dig around and figure it all out again.

>I can just use the energy of my unconscious reactions to

>bring myself back to the present moment. In fact "if" I

>try to dig around and figure it all out, I am still in the past

>and not the present. Digging around trying to figure it

>all out only perpetuates it.

 

Well, I'm certainly not asking anyone to do a lot of digging around! I

have done work for someone else, using Lynea's method, and found a lot of

LDs and cleared them... and it wasn't even necessary that the person know

about them consciously. But because they're usually interested, I send a

list of the LDs I cleared.

 

I know other methods of clearing karmic stuff from the bodies... much of

the time, you can clear stuff without even knowing what it was.

Occasionally, something does surface that needs to be faced and dealt with

consciously. The lonnnnnng way is to let it work out into events in your

outer life and deal with the karma through the events of your life...

often quite traumatic, and it certainly takes longer... years longer,

usually. Much simpler and faster to just find stuff and clear it.

 

Love,

Dharma

[Guest guest]

Hi Dharma:

 

Good wishes, warm thoughts.

 

Blessings,

Love,

 

Zenbob

[Guest guest]

Hi Dharma,

 

Today I feel like yesterday I was full of alot of hot

air. :-)

 

Please forgive. I just don't know what got into me.

I was definitely inflated. (Is it the hot air you suppose?)

 

Marcia

 

Dharma wrote:

> Dharma <fisher1

>

> Hi Marcia,

>

> >I think there is a difference between waking up and Kundalini.

> >You can wake up without the K experience or you can have

> >the K experience without waking up. I think it makes a big

> >difference which comes first. If you have some intellectual

> >appreciation already of some of your habitual patterned ways

> >of thinking, which by the way are in the entire body, then the

> >K experience is not quite so dramatic.

>

> I don't know... I went the Sky Path first... taught Raja Yoga for years,

> and I was protecting my students against K. activation. But when mine went

> into the physical... when my guide activated my K.... and 9 months later

> it went into high gear... it was quite dramatic! ) But maybe you mean

> something else... traumatic, painful??

>

> >I agree wholeheartedly that the body is essential. It is in and

> >through and with the body that I AM. I understood alot of

> >things but until I got in touch with my body there was not

> >the energy available for transformation.

>

> Depends what kind of transformation you're after. Active K. is not

> necessary to go into the All... to unite with Brahman, the Godhead...

>

> Lynea's work... finding LDs and emotional problems and clearing them...

> does not depend on anyone having active K.... and it is certainly

> transformative!

>

> Love,

> Dharma

>

> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------

>

> Show your ONElist SPIRIT!

> /store/tshirts.html

> With a new ONElist SHIRT available through our website.

>

> ------

> Eat Raw Foods and You Will Never be Constipated!

[Guest guest]

Hi again,

 

For some reason I guess I needed to say all that

yesterday. It doesn't make sense to me today. :-)

 

What do you make of that? Probably fits with your

model don't you think?

 

Marcia

 

Dharma wrote:

> Dharma <fisher1

>

> Hi Marcia,

> >

> >This conversation is getting interesting! I read this book

> >once called "The Myth of Mental Illness". I think it was

> >by Szaz or something like that. I think his postulation

> >was that there is no unconscious. While I do not

> >to that necessarily, I do think it is possible that we are

> >creating it as we go along.

>

> Well, maybe we can't even talk... if we have no terms in common. But if

> there's no unconscious, then why, in what's below, do you keep talking

> about your unconscious?

>

> >I do think it is possible that we are

> >>creating it as we go along.

>

> More like creating the conscious as we go along, I think... That's the

> tip of the iceberg... the singularity. Isn't that what the ego's for?

> The "I-making" faculty?

>

> >I think it is perspective that we are talking about. I have

> >a template. In other words I know how I operate. I may

> >not be aware of everything in my unconscious but I know

> >many of the forms they take. I know my basic character

> >structure. I can sense in my body when I am acting out

> >of pattern and I can use that sensing as a wakeup call.

> >I don't have to go dig around and figure it all out again.

> >I can just use the energy of my unconscious reactions to

> >bring myself back to the present moment. In fact "if" I

> >try to dig around and figure it all out, I am still in the past

> >and not the present. Digging around trying to figure it

> >all out only perpetuates it.

>

> Well, I'm certainly not asking anyone to do a lot of digging around! I

> have done work for someone else, using Lynea's method, and found a lot of

> LDs and cleared them... and it wasn't even necessary that the person know

> about them consciously. But because they're usually interested, I send a

> list of the LDs I cleared.

>

> I know other methods of clearing karmic stuff from the bodies... much of

> the time, you can clear stuff without even knowing what it was.

> Occasionally, something does surface that needs to be faced and dealt with

> consciously. The lonnnnnng way is to let it work out into events in your

> outer life and deal with the karma through the events of your life...

> often quite traumatic, and it certainly takes longer... years longer,

> usually. Much simpler and faster to just find stuff and clear it.

>

> Love,

> Dharma

>

> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------

>

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[Guest guest]

Hi Marcia,

>Today I feel like yesterday I was full of alot of hot

>air. :-)

>

>Please forgive. I just don't know what got into me.

>I was definitely inflated. (Is it the hot air you suppose?)

 

There was lots of strong energy around! It was the New Moon/total eclipse

of the Sun, and the planets in our solar system were in patterns that

produce strong energies and not in easy ways to handle... difficult stuff.

How it would affect anyone in particular depends on the individual natal

horoscope.

 

Those patterns are still there, except for the Moon... it keeps on

clipping around.

 

Love,

Dharma

[Guest guest]

Hi Marcia,

>For some reason I guess I needed to say all that

>yesterday. It doesn't make sense to me today. :-)

>

>What do you make of that? Probably fits with your

>model don't you think?

>

Well, since you ask ... this part:

>> >I don't have to go dig around and figure it all out again.

>> >I can just use the energy of my unconscious reactions to

>> >bring myself back to the present moment. In fact "if" I

>> >try to dig around and figure it all out, I am still in the past

>> >and not the present. Digging around trying to figure it

>> >all out only perpetuates it.

 

looks like a pretty strong defense against any attempt to discover

unconscious stuff... so maybe you might be afraid of it? And if you're

afraid of looking, maybe there's something there to find?

 

Since you don't know why you said it yesterday, maybe there's also

something unconscious that made the defense against looking. That's not

bad... just means part of you is protecting another part of you. It

might be a nurturing mother... or a tender lover... who is concerned that

another part of you might be hurt.

 

I know looking for these things can be scary. But what we don't know about

is more dangerous than anything that we do know about... just because it's

in the unconscious, and we can't see what it's doing. And sometimes

unconscious stuff causes people to act in ways they don't like, don't

understand... sometimes aren't even aware of. So, for myself, I would

rather know than not know.

 

Quite often these things can be discovered and cleared with no discomfort,

or very little. But sometimes something just won't be handled...

cleared... until we face it consciously... remember, acknowledge,

re-experience, forgive... whatever it takes. For me, it's worth doing...

even if it's traumatic at times. It feels so good to get rid of all that

stuff! )) And if there's a nurturing mother or a tender lover in the

unconscious, why not enjoy knowing them?

 

Love,

Dharma

[Guest guest]

Hi Dharma,

 

Well the nurturing mother and the tender lover are not

in the unconscious. :-)

 

I will tell you what my conscious mind reacts to. And that

may be the thread to the unconscious.

 

It is the devouring mother portrayal. I loved my mother dearly.

But she was not able to really be a nurturer cause of her upbringing.

She was from a family of thirteen children (she was fourth) during

the depression with an alcoholic father who beat the kids. She was

really not in her body and she was unable to accept bodies if you

know what I mean.

 

But she loved me as best as she knew how. And I loved her.

When she became ill I nursed her till she died. I held her hand

as she died and I felt her joy. I think mothers get a bad rap. Can

it be that simple? Or does it mean there are buried reasons

that I feel this way? I feel loyal to my mother. I want to tell

people whose mothers are still alive not to waste precious time.

I will be eternally grateful for having been there for my mother

when she needed me.

 

Marcia

 

Dharma wrote:

> Dharma <fisher1

>

> Hi Marcia,

>

> >For some reason I guess I needed to say all that

> >yesterday. It doesn't make sense to me today. :-)

> >

> >What do you make of that? Probably fits with your

> >model don't you think?

> >

> Well, since you ask ... this part:

>

> >> >I don't have to go dig around and figure it all out again.

> >> >I can just use the energy of my unconscious reactions to

> >> >bring myself back to the present moment. In fact "if" I

> >> >try to dig around and figure it all out, I am still in the past

> >> >and not the present. Digging around trying to figure it

> >> >all out only perpetuates it.

>

> looks like a pretty strong defense against any attempt to discover

> unconscious stuff... so maybe you might be afraid of it? And if you're

> afraid of looking, maybe there's something there to find?

>

> Since you don't know why you said it yesterday, maybe there's also

> something unconscious that made the defense against looking. That's not

> bad... just means part of you is protecting another part of you. It

> might be a nurturing mother... or a tender lover... who is concerned that

> another part of you might be hurt.

>

> I know looking for these things can be scary. But what we don't know about

> is more dangerous than anything that we do know about... just because it's

> in the unconscious, and we can't see what it's doing. And sometimes

> unconscious stuff causes people to act in ways they don't like, don't

> understand... sometimes aren't even aware of. So, for myself, I would

> rather know than not know.

>

> Quite often these things can be discovered and cleared with no discomfort,

> or very little. But sometimes something just won't be handled...

> cleared... until we face it consciously... remember, acknowledge,

> re-experience, forgive... whatever it takes. For me, it's worth doing...

> even if it's traumatic at times. It feels so good to get rid of all that

> stuff! )) And if there's a nurturing mother or a tender lover in the

> unconscious, why not enjoy knowing them?

>

> Love,

> Dharma

>

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[Guest guest]

Just out of curiosity do you do a Western chart or

the Hindu chart when you cast a horoscope? I have

done both. My understanding is that they are 30 degrees

difference. I feel more like the Hindu one fits me.

 

Marcia

 

Dharma wrote:

> Dharma <fisher1

>

> Hi Marcia,

>

> >Today I feel like yesterday I was full of alot of hot

> >air. :-)

> >

> >Please forgive. I just don't know what got into me.

> >I was definitely inflated. (Is it the hot air you suppose?)

>

> There was lots of strong energy around! It was the New Moon/total eclipse

> of the Sun, and the planets in our solar system were in patterns that

> produce strong energies and not in easy ways to handle... difficult stuff.

> How it would affect anyone in particular depends on the individual natal

> horoscope.

>

> Those patterns are still there, except for the Moon... it keeps on

> clipping around.

>

> Love,

> Dharma

>

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