Secret Shame ... Marcia again ... Dharma for you too

[Guest guest]

Hi Marcia ...

 

and the moral of the story is that there are a lot of therapists 'out there' who

don't recognise that the client is the mirror for their own stuff ...

 

If I have an issue come up for me when working with a client, before I say

anything, the first question I ask my self is ...

 

"What is this person showing me that I need to resolve within my self" ...

 

If the answer is unclear, or if there is a reaction from my body, I say nothing

....

 

If I feel clear, I then ask the question of the client "is it possible ... that

...." which does not 'dump' anything on the client, but gives the client

permission to look at a belief he/she may be carrying in the physical body that

may not even be theirs ... without dumping my stuff on the client ...

 

 

a belief in the unconscious that may be running us can come from a number of

sources ... it doesn't have to be true ... but if the belief is in the body, it

is unconsciously influencing us whether we know it or not ...

 

The approach I use is to acknowledge the possibility that the belief exists ...

if there is a reaction, then there is (for me), something there ... if it goes

away, then nothing further need be done ... and often that is the case ...

 

If there is something there, I then ... and only then ... give myself permission

to understand where the belief comes from so that it can be released from the

body ...

 

In many cases, the limiting beliefs are taken on from people we are close with

.... we take them on unconsciously as an act of love ... I remember two sisters

.... one (A) did not have any memory of an incident that the other (B) had memory

of... but when (B) was able to release the memory, (A) became conscious of it

.... and their mother confirmed that the incident had in fact happened to (A) ...

even though the sisters were miles apart at the time of the incident ...

 

The interesting sidelight to this was that both sisters bore identical

(physical) scars of the same incident ... and that incident was running (A)'s

life ...

 

Christopher Wynter

 

 

-

Marcia Paul <jacpa

< >

Thursday, 12 August 1999 11:13

Re: Secret Shame ...

 

> Marcia Paul <jacpa

>

> Hi Dharma,

>

> This conversation is getting interesting! I read this book

> once called "The Myth of Mental Illness". I think it was

> by Szaz or something like that. I think his postulation

> was that there is no unconscious. While I do not

> to that necessarily, I do think it is possible that we are

> creating it as we go along.

>

> I think it is perspective that we are talking about. I have

> a template. In other words I know how I operate. I may

> not be aware of everything in my unconscious but I know

> many of the forms they take. I know my basic character

> structure. I can sense in my body when I am acting out

> of pattern and I can use that sensing as a wakeup call.

> I don't have to go dig around and figure it all out again.

> I can just use the energy of my unconscious reactions to

> bring myself back to the present moment. In fact "if" I

> try to dig around and figure it all out, I am still in the past

> and not the present. Digging around trying to figure it

> all out only perpetuates it. It is enough to know that

> something from my past is intruding. Why do I have to

> know all the nuances? Those are distractions from being

> right here right now. You can't make insanity sane no

> matter how hard you try. It is like looking for your keys

> under the light and not where you lost them.

>

> I went for a massage the other day. The lady was into

> analysis as well as massage. She began to tell me that

> she felt a great sorrow coming from me and that it

> happened around my mother and probably around the

> age of five. After the massage I came home and was

> telling a friend about my sorrow. He said..."Of course.

> Your aren't a four (enneagram type four...tragic romantic)

> for nothing." At that moment I woke up. I had been

> believing this great sorrow stuff. I was beginning to model

> an entire "story" around my great sorrow. What a relief

> that my friend was there to give me a shake.

>

> Marcia

>

> Dharma wrote:

>

> > Dharma <fisher1

> >

> > Hi Marcia,

> > >

> > >I think we are saying the same thing really. A limiting decision

> > >is the drama. We have these limiting decisions and then we

> > >begin to believe that they are real and not decisions that we

> > >have made.

> >

> > I don't think you understood what I was saying. We're talking about

> > unconscious stuff... that means the conscious mind is unaware of it. You

> > don't believe anything about it, because you don't even know it exists.

> >

> > What we do know is that someone has a problem. Or it might even be someone

> > wanting to clean up her karmic stuff and unconscious blocks even without

> > thinking there's a problem. There are ways to find these things... to

> > bring them out of the unconscious.

> >

> > > We identify (give it our identity) with the decision

> > >and make it real. Then we work on clearing it out as if it were

> > >real in the first place. All I am suggesting is that the entire process

> > >might be easier if we did not believe the "story" in the first place.

> > >I think it might be a matter of perspective. It just seems like more

> > >melodrama than is needed if you label it such things like secrets

> > >and shame.

> >

> > Nobody labeled this... it was discovered, see? It was there! "Secret"

> > and "shame" are words that come from Fiona... from her unconscious stuff.

> > They might not apply to the next person... it might be something entirely

> > different.

> >

> > > These are laden with heaviness and gravity. I guess I

> > >am suggesting moving it over to the side of a universal dilemma

> > >rather than a personal one. You know like saying...."Oh there goes

> > >Marcia doing her fussing thing." rather than "Marcia has a deep

> > >sorrow from her time in the womb." Make any sense?

> >

> > No, Marcia. This is not stuff we think of in one way or another... or

> > believe or don't believe... or exaggerate or don't exaggerate. It's stuff

> > that we don't even know about... until it's discovered by one of these

> > methods... Whatever is unconscious is NOT conscious... by definition and

> > in fact.

> >

> > Love,

> > Dharma

> >

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