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In a message dated 9/20/1999 1:12:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

max_harris writes:

 

<< so too just because our images of God are constructed

doesn't mean God doesn't exist. >>

 

I love this! And I agree that God pulls us (God) into God. My experience is

not non-dualism vs. dualism but non-dualism/dualism all inside a big

Something Else. Holly

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Max: ...This type of experience has convinced me that God's heart

is always broken as well as full of joy; and I have little

patience for notions of an impersonal impassible God.

 

I read once, but can't remember if it was Aurobindo or

someone else, that a proper sense of "ananda" is not bliss,

but rather deep "feeling" which includes all bliss and all

sorrow, ecstatic joy and tearing agony, a feeling which

embraces and contains all these.

 

If God is interested in life and deeply knows it,

surely this is what ananda should mean.

 

Dan: Are we not each constructing God and reality through the lens

of our experiencing? Is there one set thing that ananda should

mean (in fact, your post suggests that there might not be)? Is there one

universal reality to be understood, explained, and experienced one way?

>From here, I see many ways of viewing, many constructions. Some

seemingly more personal, some seemingly more impersonal. I thank you for

yours, as you have expressed it sincerely and clearly.

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Dan Berkow wrote:

> Are we not each constructing God and reality through the lens

> of our experiencing? Is there one set thing that ananda should

> mean (in fact, your post suggests that there might not be)? Is there

one

>universal reality to be understood, explained, and experienced one way?

>From here, I see many ways of viewing, many constructions. Some

> seemingly more personal, some seemingly more impersonal.

 

Yes, it is inescapable that our understanding of God and reality

is constructed out of our experiences.

 

And yes, we shouldn't expect to be able to limit the meaning of

the word "ananda" to one person's understanding.

 

And yes, we shouldn't expect to be able to experience the one

reality in the same way.

 

I view the Brahman concept of God to be true but not complete.

I view the Jewish mystic's concept of God to be true but not

complete.

I view most concepts of the Absolute to be true but incomplete.

I don't believe any concept of the Absolute can be complete.

 

A lover of the Divine knows God just as clearly as we know

anyone we're infatuated with. We build around the reality

in itself our personal experience of that reality; an image

is constructed through which we gain access to the reality,

without fully capturing it or fathoming it. Even the sense

of merging with the reality is in part a construction.

 

But just as the fact that we construct an image around

the one we love doesn't mean the beloved doesn't exist,

so too just because our images of God are constructed

doesn't mean God doesn't exist. The constructed image

is our mode of access to the reality, and with repeated

intimacy it is to be hoped that the internal distances

between the image and the reality continually decrease.

 

But there is a richness in the reality which will prevent

any exhaustion of the internal distances, and an element

of mystery will forever remain as an endless allure.

 

Namste,

-- Max

 

---------------------------

FREE - yourname - Visit http://www.philosophers.net

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In a message dated 09/20/1999 4:53:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

dorf01 writes:

 

<< On Mon, 20 Sep 1999 Hbarrett47 wrote:

>

> I love this! And I agree that God pulls us (God) into God. My experience

is

> not non-dualism vs. dualism but non-dualism/dualism all inside a big

> Something Else. Holly

>

 

but isnt 'something else' creating another dualism?

 

--janpa

>>

Received this from a friend today, I love it, is like the reception of energy

and the giving of energies:

 

Humility and Love met in a grove long ago.

 

Love brought fruit and wine.

 

Humility brought hunger, appreciation, and acceptance.

 

To say it was Love or Humility that drew them together would be to limit God.

 

These two were created for each other.

 

They lived in and gave to each other.

 

In the grove today are rocks and apples, deer and lion.

 

The world has turned many times, always in the same direction.

 

Love and Humility have grown so alike the G*ds cannot tell them apart.

 

Who knows where they will throw their blanket?

 

This meeting, this kneeling before each other is a sacred grove.

 

I will meet you there, at the still point nexus, the mist of beginning, where

we cannot tell who is who.

 

Love*Light*Laughter,

RainboLily

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On Mon, 20 Sep 1999 Hbarrett47 wrote:

>

> I love this! And I agree that God pulls us (God) into God. My experience is

> not non-dualism vs. dualism but non-dualism/dualism all inside a big

> Something Else. Holly

>

 

but isnt 'something else' creating another dualism?

 

--janpa

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In a message dated 9/20/1999 4:53:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

dorf01 writes:

 

<< but isnt 'something else' creating another dualism? >>

 

Absolutely (no pun intended!). I wasn't trying to talk about Truth, rather

my constantly shifting experience of it. No matter how much I see God, know

I am God, etc., I'm never going to figure out how I managed the Big Bang.

Holly

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On 9/20/99 at 2:39 PM Hbarrett47 wrote:

>In a message dated 9/20/1999 1:12:52 PM Eastern Daylight

Time,

>max_harris writes:

>

><< so too just because our images of God are constructed

> doesn't mean God doesn't exist. >>

>

>I love this! And I agree that God pulls us (God) into God.

My experience is

>not non-dualism vs. dualism but non-dualism/dualism all

inside a big

>Something Else. Holly

 

Don't worry Holly. It has been my experience that nonduality

(Being without support) will come naturally, even if one

hasn't heard of it before. If it wouldn't be that way,

nonduality would be just another mental construct.

 

Jan

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Hbarrett47 wrote:

> << but isnt 'something else' creating another dualism? >>

>

> Absolutely (no pun intended!). I wasn't trying to talk about Truth, rather

> my constantly shifting experience of it. No matter how much I see God, know

> I am God, etc., I'm never going to figure out how I managed the Big Bang.

> Holly

 

Hello Holly,

 

"Some spirits with lack of respect pretend that man was created in a

laughter. YHWH would be the sound of this laughter." Denis Labouré

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Hbarrett47 wrote:

> << but isnt 'something else' creating another dualism? >>

>

> Absolutely (no pun intended!). I wasn't trying to talk about Truth, rather

> my constantly shifting experience of it. No matter how much I see God, know

> I am God, etc., I'm never going to figure out how I managed the Big Bang.

> Holly

 

ivan:Yes. There is the unknown, and the unknowable. We, as humans at least, can

not even dream of finding that out. It is sweetly unknowable!!

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In a message dated 9/21/99 8:06:00 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

Hbarrett47 writes:

 

<< Absolutely (no pun intended!). I wasn't trying to talk about Truth,

rather

my constantly shifting experience of it. No matter how much I see God, know

I am God, etc., I'm never going to figure out how I managed the Big Bang.

>>

Dear Holly:

 

My dear Holly, if you had figured out how you "did the Big Bang" you would

never have done it and we would not be here now. It's like figuring out

exactly how one walks across a room. You don't figure it out, you simply "do

it."

 

Blessings

 

Zenbob

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In a message dated 9/22/1999 3:39:41 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

ZEN2WRK writes:

 

<<

My dear Holly, if you had figured out how you "did the Big Bang" you would

never have done it and we would not be here now. It's like figuring out

exactly how one walks across a room. You don't figure it out, you simply

"do

it." >>

 

Thanks for this! As they say, God is a verb. Holly

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