Guest guest Posted November 26, 1999 Report Share Posted November 26, 1999 Namaste All, Jan, Dan, et al, Yes I do have compassion for those who eat meat; for I am aware of the karma and impediments it causes, or is. It is ok to intellectualise about non-duality, but that is an attachment and duality itself, who writes this? It seems to me that there are impediments for remembering that we are free and not in bondage. That we are Liberation and don't have to seek, just wake up. These impediments all boil down to the ego and a lack of awareness, They are the scum on top of the pond that stops the sun's reflection. Once gone all is clean, but until the slightest scum is cleaned, there is that impediment to remembering or liberation. That slight scum holds us in the manomayakosa that we love so well(sounds like a very old song). Unless we can move above the mind to the vijnanamayakosa there will be no liberation. I feel sorry for those that can't connect their food with the suffering of the animal. With regard to plants again they do react to suffering, of another plant for example, but they don't have the comprehensive nervous system of an animal. It is faulty logic to compare them, don't you think? It would be another step to nuts and berries, but what I am talking about is 'intent'. If a person takes a step to being a vegetarian it is a step in purifying the buddhi and toward the vijnanamayakosa. That is perhaps rationalisation but it is to do with intent and motive to cause the least harm one can. Ahimsa is much broader than this though, but this isn't the topic of this post. Another impediment is the dissemination of animal qualities into man along with the meat. As long as one eats meat and builds up these animal qualities, one will never be aware of a reason not to eat meat, as the animal isn't either. I realise that not all will do so in this life but making a start somewhere is important. Love and Sai Ram, Tony. ===== http://members.xoom.com/aoclery/ (glossary incl?) Keep on truckin-Chant the Gayatri! Breathe So----Ham! "God is formless. In order to merge in the formless God, you have to give up identification with the body." "There is only one 'Soul' and 'That' is God." Sai Baba. Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Shopping: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 26, 1999 Report Share Posted November 26, 1999 Dear Tony: I do not know if anyone can state when or how a person will become 'liberated'.....I do not doubt that Jesus was enlightened and I have never heard of him being a vegetarian. There is a fairly well known yogic tradition of eating meat, drinking alcohol, enjoying unlimited sex to help achieve liberation. That would not be my choice but I also do not feel that it can ever be stated that no one eating meat can achieve liberation. However, the awareness or consciousness of a person does go through a purification and move to a heightened perception when one chooses to stop participating in violence towards animals. I have had a rather interesting Thanksgiving. Given some crazy dynamics with some family members I have recently moved to New York and provided a home to my 21 year old daughter who was careening quickly down a road of self-destruction in Florida. We moved within 15 minutes of an ashram that is part of her chosen path. My ex-husband who is rather ill and has had to apply for disability moved up here with our 4 year old granddaughter just this past Monday. Ex-husband will stay with me until his disability if approved. The 4 year old will of course, stay longer....until her mother (my daughter) is able to support her on her own. The one thing I have insisted upon is that there be no meat cooked in the house......the truck was still being unpacked the day before Thanksgiving so no food other than a couple of pies was prepared. The ashram served a wonderful, meatless meal for the holiday. Now for some there would be nothing but a sense of gratitude that a safe haven was provided to them in the form of a warm, cheerful house and an inexpensive and shakti filled meal for Thanksgiving was waiting for them after a move from a state that is over 1200 miles away. However, what was commented on the most was the fact that both of these individuals missed the turkey. It was with sadness that I noticed this lack of awareness of how much they both have to be thankful for on this Thanksgiving. Maybe rather than speculating on whether not eating meat plays a role in liberation we should be concentrating on as you state...... simply an awareness that is of a higher order. Namaste, Linda >Namaste All, Jan, Dan, et al, >Yes I do have compassion for those who eat meat; for I >am aware of the karma and impediments it causes, or >is. It is ok to intellectualise about non-duality, but >that is an attachment and duality itself, who writes >this? It seems to me that there are impediments for >remembering that we are free and not in bondage. That >we are Liberation and don't have to seek, just wake >up. >These impediments all boil down to the ego and a lack >of awareness, They are the scum on top of the pond >that stops the sun's reflection. Once gone all is >clean, but until the slightest scum is cleaned, there >is that impediment to remembering or liberation. That >slight scum holds us in the manomayakosa that we love >so well(sounds like a very old song). >Unless we can move above the mind to the >vijnanamayakosa there will be no liberation. I feel >sorry for those that can't connect their food with the >suffering of the animal. >Another impediment is the dissemination of animal >qualities into man along with the meat. As long as one >eats meat and builds up these animal qualities, one >will never be aware of a reason not to eat meat, as >the animal isn't either. I realise that not all will >do so in this life but making a start somewhere is >important. >Love and Sai Ram, Tony. ===== http://members.xoom.com/aoclery/ (glossary incl?) Keep on truckin-Chant the Gayatri! Breathe So----Ham! "God is formless. In order to merge in the formless God, you have to give up identification with the body." "There is only one 'Soul' and 'That' is God." Sai Baba. Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Shopping: All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 27, 1999 Report Share Posted November 27, 1999 Speaking of compassion, Linda, I'm inspired by your compassionate devotion to your family -- my hat is off to you! Yours is a wonderful example of taking what one is given in life and making a miracle out of it. Love, Holly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 29, 1999 Report Share Posted November 29, 1999 Dear Holly, It is always so nice to hear from you...I hope you are doing well. Right now as the 4 year old runs through the house, chasing Shanti the cat...I feel that the true miracle will be if I survive this without getting any ticks, twitches or ending up babbling through the rest of my life:). This past year seems to have been one of challenge for many of us as our life shifted and I seem to recall that some of us (you and I included) disappeared from the list for a while. Through this time many seem to be feeling isolated from others and wondering about connections to others. Yesterday I came across this wonderful poem from Rumi. TWO FRIENDS A certain person come to the Friend's door and knocked. "Who's there?" "It's me." The Friend answered, "Go away. There's no place for raw meat at this table." The individual went wandering for a year. Nothing but the fire of separation can change hypocrisy and ego. The person returned completely cooked, walked up and down in front of the Friend's house, gently knocked. "Who is it?" "You." "Please come in, my self, there's no place in this house for two........." THE ESSENTIAL RUMI....Coleman Barks with John Moyne Hope you had a wonderful holiday. Love, Linda >Speaking of compassion, Linda, I'm inspired by your compassionate devotion to >your family -- my hat is off to you! Yours is a wonderful example of taking >what one is given in life and making a miracle out of it. Love, Holly All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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