Guest guest Posted March 10, 2000 Report Share Posted March 10, 2000 Namaste All, Could somebody please sort out the gobbledegook, and please tell me what the words, 'realisation', 'enlightened', mean, to these lists? My understanding, up until now was that they meant the same thing as Moksha/Liberation/No Mind/Merging with the Self etc. It is confusing to my mind, yes I still have one. Here is where I am at, perhaps someone can tell me which slot I am.ha ah a aha. That comes from ekagratha or practising one-pointedness. I have a mind, somewhat dysfunctional, sometimes happy, sometimes depressed, like many who quietly living their lives. Not in quiet desperation as someone said, Lincoln? I have some spiritual and K experiences, also some kind of 'samadhis'. Also some kind of non dual, oneness type happenings. I know I am part of a whole and that really I am an illusion. I see that all is the universal everywhere, my dog, the tree everybody. So I am enlightened to that extent, and I realise my situation or illusion. I find the teachings of Ramanashram to be true for me. Also other Jnanis like Jesus, Sankara, Maharaj etc. All Adwaitic. However I have a Bhakti dimension as well. However I still have a mind and I still see the world, that means to me that I haven't finished the journey. So what do these words mean? Realisation, Enlightened.I know what Moksha, Maya and illusion mean. Om Namah Sivaya, Tony. ===== http://members.xoom.com/aoclery/sanskritglos.htm ASATHO MA SATH GAMAYA, From the unreal lead me to the real, THAMASO MA JYOTHIR GAMAYA, From darkness, lead me to light, MRITHYOR MA AMRITAM GAMAYA.From death, lead me to immortality. OM, SHANTI SHANTI SHANTI. Om, Peace Peace Peace. Talk to your friends online with Messenger. http://im. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 10, 2000 Report Share Posted March 10, 2000 Tony, Like Harsha (I think) said, you are unique and authentic. And I love you, feel your power and passion in all this. You are going to get a lot of answers on this!! It was Thoreau, in Walden I think, who said "The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation." Here is my concept of enlightenment/nirvana, etc. Samsara is seeing a difference between nirvana and samsara. Nirvana is not seeing a difference between nirvana and samsara. There is really no individualized entity to be the possessor of enlightenment or unenlightenment. Enlightenment or its lack cannot reside in any of the 5 koshas, because the koshas are not more than appearances in consciousness. There is no real "X" and "Y," where we can say "X" is enlightened and "Y" is not enlightened. If one truly believes that some real "X" are enlightened and others are not, then there's a sticky belief in some kind of jiva or lifestream that is the holder of enlightenment. And what exactly would that holder be? Instead, all is light. This of course is consistent with your traditional definition of sahaja samadhi, no mind, no samskaras, etc. In a conventional-teaching sense, however, enlightenment is often used as an encouraging and motivational term. It is an inspirational way to recognize great world-teachers, and there are many of us who would like to emulate them. (Like Jerry, I don't have the hair for it!!) But oddly enough, these great teachers never say that people must be vastly influential and famous like they themselves are. No, often they rather say, just BE. And another purpose of the term "enlightenment" is like the ultimate goal-of-goals for the sadhaka, and interpreted each to her own. This keeps one on steadily the path. It functions like this until it falls away. I think Osho said, "Enlightenment is a concept for the unelightened," a phrase which paradoxically mixes both the conventional and esoteric levels. And then, as you know from scripture and literature, there is often that irreversible non-moment outside of time when the whole thing is intuited, and laughter results. I don't have the citation, but I heard it attributed to Buddha this saying. Another saying that mixes both the conventional and esoteric levels: "When I was enlightened, I saw that the whole world had always been enlightened. With love, --Greg >Tony O'Clery <aoclery > >Namaste All, > >Could somebody please sort out the gobbledegook, and >please tell me what the words, 'realisation', >'enlightened', mean, to these lists? >My understanding, up until now was that they meant the >same thing as Moksha/Liberation/No Mind/Merging with >the Self etc. It is confusing to my mind, yes I still >have one. > >Here is where I am at, perhaps someone can tell me >which slot I am.ha ah a aha. That comes from ekagratha >or practising one-pointedness. > >I have a mind, somewhat dysfunctional, sometimes >happy, sometimes depressed, like many who quietly >living their lives. Not in quiet desperation as >someone said, Lincoln? > >I have some spiritual and K experiences, also some >kind of 'samadhis'. Also some kind of non dual, >oneness type happenings. I know I am part of a whole >and that really I am an illusion. > > I see that all is the universal everywhere, my dog, >the tree everybody. So I am enlightened to that >extent, and I realise my situation or illusion. > >I find the teachings of Ramanashram to be true for me. >Also other Jnanis like Jesus, Sankara, Maharaj etc. >All Adwaitic. However I have a Bhakti dimension as >well. > >However I still have a mind and I still see the world, >that means to me that I haven't finished the journey. > > >So what do these words mean? Realisation, >Enlightened.I know what Moksha, Maya and illusion >mean. > >Om Namah Sivaya, Tony. > >===== >http://members.xoom.com/aoclery/sanskritglos.htm > >ASATHO MA SATH GAMAYA, From the unreal lead me to the real, >THAMASO MA JYOTHIR GAMAYA, From darkness, lead me to light, >MRITHYOR MA AMRITAM GAMAYA.From death, lead me to immortality. >OM, SHANTI SHANTI SHANTI. Om, Peace Peace Peace. > > >Talk to your friends online with Messenger. >http://im. > >------ >GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9% >Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW! >http://click./1/936/3/_/520931/_/952724254/ >------ > >// > >All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a. > >To from this list, go to the ONElist web site, at > www., and select the User Center link from the menu bar > on the left. This menu will also let you change your subscription > between digest and normal mode. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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