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neti yeti/Moller

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>M: It describes the classical neti-neti way, which I regard

>as a dangerous teaching because it presumes from the start that there is

>something to be found, just take all appearances away, and it will be there.

>This presumption will become a self-fulfilling reality, leaving the seeker

>with this presumed 'I' which is then equated with the Self. But we could go

>into this at another time if you like.

 

D: Greetings, Moller. Enjoying your commentary here.

There is no other time to go into this, only

now :-)

As seen here:

Neti, neti undermines the very assumptions that allow

one to use neti, neti as a process.

It ends thinking in terms of process, getting somewhere,

or knowing where one is starting, or who would be starting.

So, in a sense it may be dangerous, in the sense that disorientation,

the unknown may be dangerous. Yet, in the end, the negation

negates itself. Neti inevitably undermines its own position

to negate. It is a "tool" to be discarded, at the point

where there is no point, no place to stand.

 

If neti, neti "occurs" instantly and totally, rather than

one piece at a time, everything is instantly

thrown into doubt, even the basis for doubting anything

is thrown into doubt. Instantly "done" it is nonvolitional

and timeless. It ends the assumptions, the comparisons

that give a sense of time.

 

Certainly any assumption that something will be left

is to be discarded.

So my view of neti, neti is that it allows no place to

rest, no assumption, no affirmation.

The opposite of neti, neti is to include All.

Including everything leads to the inclusion of negation.

To include all is to negate all.

Creation and destruction are mutually interdependent.

To come into being is to go out of being, to

be is to be not.

 

Love,

Dan

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Dear Dan,

 

Yes Dan, as usual you are perfectly right. Yours is indeed a very

interesting presentation of this 'practice'. It could indeed undermine

everything even itself.

 

As an afterthought to my letter to Roger on some thing he send us about

Barry ?, I felt it may just be worth pointing to the traditional approach to

this method. They say take away everything, and what remains will be the

Self, reality etc. But they seem to approach the process from the position

that none of the things they reject are reality/Self. Ie, I am not my mind,

my body etc. To be able to say this, there must be knowledge of what the

I/Self is. So the whole thing starts with an assumption. If the Self is

All, and this Self is not my body, what is the body then?

 

So I was trying to point to this difficulty in this practice which can be

very misleading unless understood as you have so beautifully explained it.

 

Thank you for that.

 

love and respect,

 

Your Brother M

 

Dan Berkow, PhD <berkowd

< >

21 March 2000 09:05

Re: neti yeti/Moller

 

>"Dan Berkow, PhD" <berkowd

>

>>M: It describes the classical neti-neti way, which I regard

>>as a dangerous teaching because it presumes from the start that there is

>>something to be found, just take all appearances away, and it will be

there.

>>This presumption will become a self-fulfilling reality, leaving the seeker

>>with this presumed 'I' which is then equated with the Self. But we could

go

>>into this at another time if you like.

>

>D: Greetings, Moller. Enjoying your commentary here.

> There is no other time to go into this, only

> now :-)

> As seen here:

> Neti, neti undermines the very assumptions that allow

> one to use neti, neti as a process.

> It ends thinking in terms of process, getting somewhere,

> or knowing where one is starting, or who would be starting.

> So, in a sense it may be dangerous, in the sense that disorientation,

> the unknown may be dangerous. Yet, in the end, the negation

> negates itself. Neti inevitably undermines its own position

> to negate. It is a "tool" to be discarded, at the point

> where there is no point, no place to stand.

>

> If neti, neti "occurs" instantly and totally, rather than

> one piece at a time, everything is instantly

> thrown into doubt, even the basis for doubting anything

> is thrown into doubt. Instantly "done" it is nonvolitional

> and timeless. It ends the assumptions, the comparisons

> that give a sense of time.

>

> Certainly any assumption that something will be left

> is to be discarded.

> So my view of neti, neti is that it allows no place to

> rest, no assumption, no affirmation.

> The opposite of neti, neti is to include All.

> Including everything leads to the inclusion of negation.

> To include all is to negate all.

> Creation and destruction are mutually interdependent.

> To come into being is to go out of being, to

> be is to be not.

>

> Love,

> Dan

>

>

>

>

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