Guest guest Posted May 1, 2000 Report Share Posted May 1, 2000 Most of the world ignores "This", seeing no use or value for "This". Most of the world values tangible things, status, power, or enjoyable or rewarding experiences. Thus, through ignorance, "This" which is not tangible nor an experience is never noticed. Of those who begin to break through ignorance, many continue on fruitless paths in pursuit of This, believing they "see glimpses" and thus generate beliefs that reinforce their vain pursuit. Others vainly claim they are "being This", lost in self-delusion and their own positive conceptual affirmations. Still others futilely try to negate what is "not-This", never able to reach an end to that which must be negated. Only when their is no investment in ignorance, and when the utter futility of all approaches and non- approaches is seen, will there be the dropping away of avoidance, useless efforts, and the unrewarding pursuit or self-conscious non-pursuit of an imagined effortless mode of being. Pursuit and the attempt to gain This through non-pursuit are both grounded in thought. Thoughts are understandable only in the context of prior thoughts. Thus, thought ultimately has no ground. Experiences register in the context of previous experiences. Thus, experience ultimately has no ground. Similarly, feelings relate to prior feelings, and sensations are interpreted against the background of other sensations. "This" which has nothing prior to itself cannot be experienced, intuited, felts, sensed, remembered, or cognized. To speak of "This" is completely paradoxical, because speech about "This" always occurs as simply more speech, thought, and reference to experience. Because such speech is paradoxical, some consider it ludicrous. However, This Itself is neither paradoxical nor absurd. It is merely speaking of This that is paradox and absurdity. Such speech has never occurred for any meaningful reason other than to bring attention to the prevalence of ignorance. It is futile to call It "That" which experiences, remembers, or cognizes, or to call It "consciousness", "awareness", "Self", or "God" -- all of these concepts are merely ways to formulate an idea and a relationship to an idea, more thoughts interpreted against the background of other thoughts. Similarly, saying there is "no one" who is doer or cognizer simply contributes additional thought-statements about reality, depending as do other thoughts on a prior thought context for meaning. Negating thoughts and concepts will never lead to It. The activity of negating depends on something to be negated. This very dependency doesn't allow This with nothing prior to Itself to emerge from the activities of negation. Similarly, inquiry is dependent on a question being there, and meditation is dependent on the context in which meditation has meaning. That which has nothing beyond Itself will never be found, constructed, nor recognized - and neither inquiry nor meditation/contemplation will lead to This. One may seek a teacher or spiritual path, but such will only provide more sensation, thought, and experience. One may seek to let go, but this activity will always depend on there being something to let go. One may attempt to do nothing, but passivity will have no power to interfere with thought seeking after thought, experience leading to accumulation of further experience, etc. Indeed, there cannot be shown to be anything "out there" beyond sensation and thought that is being sensed and thought about. Anything said to be "out there" is a thought interpretation about sensory or intuitive experience. The so-called "reality beyond" or "reality out there" turns out to be more data in the realm of concept and experience. Thus, claims about "'Something' beyond thought and sensation" are as absurd and paradoxical as any other speech about This. When nothing is "placed 'out there'", there is nothing "in here". Then, nothing can be said to be or not to be. Then, neither concepts of death, nor birth, nor deathlessness, nor birthlessness apply. This is beyond any statements, activities, or inactivities. Now is recognized the futility of any efforts and non-efforts intended to find This, be This, reveal This, or negate what is not This. There is literally nothing else at this point other than recognizing the utter futility of all efforts and non-efforts, cognitions, feelings, and experiences. As far as this statement itself being addtional futile verbiage interpreted in the context of prior words and ideas - it is so. This statement itself cannot lead to "This" any more than can any other statement, question, negation, or assertion. Neither a path nor a pathless way of being will reveal "This". -- Dan -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2000 Report Share Posted May 1, 2000 In a message dated 5/1/00 12:38:59 PM Mountain Daylight Time, carrea writes: << It seems the day words started to make sense, the world stopped to make any. >> Your intuitive hits are terrific, Antoine! There's a wonderful book by David Abrams (I think) called The Spell of the Sensuous. He writes about the great loss of original "knowing" that came with the written word -- perhaps our exit from Eden. Holly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2000 Report Share Posted May 1, 2000 It seems the day words started to make sense, the world stopped to make any. Antoine , "Dan Berkow, PhD" <berkowd@u...> wrote: > Most of the world ignores "This", seeing no use > or value for "This". Most of the world values > tangible things, status, power, or enjoyable or > rewarding experiences. Thus, through ignorance, > "This" which is not tangible nor an experience > is never noticed. > Of those who begin to break through ignorance, many > continue on fruitless paths in pursuit of This, > believing they "see glimpses" and thus generate > beliefs that reinforce their vain pursuit. > Others vainly claim they are "being This", lost > in self-delusion and their own positive > conceptual affirmations. > Still others futilely try to negate what is "not-This", > never able to reach an end to that which must be negated. > > Only when their is no investment in ignorance, > and when the utter futility of all approaches and non- approaches is > seen, will there be the dropping away > of avoidance, useless efforts, and the unrewarding pursuit > or self-conscious non-pursuit of an imagined effortless > mode of being. > > Pursuit and the attempt to gain This through non-pursuit > are both grounded in thought. > Thoughts are understandable only in the context > of prior thoughts. Thus, thought ultimately has > no ground. > Experiences register in the context of previous experiences. > Thus, experience ultimately has no ground. > Similarly, feelings relate to prior feelings, and > sensations are interpreted against the background > of other sensations. > > "This" which has nothing prior to itself > cannot be experienced, intuited, felts, > sensed, remembered, or cognized. > To speak of "This" is completely paradoxical, because > speech about "This" always occurs as simply more > speech, thought, and reference to experience. > Because such speech is paradoxical, some consider it > ludicrous. However, This Itself is neither paradoxical > nor absurd. It is merely speaking of This that is paradox > and absurdity. Such speech has never occurred for any > meaningful reason other than to bring attention to > the prevalence of ignorance. > > It is futile to call It "That" which experiences, > remembers, or cognizes, or to call It > "consciousness", "awareness", "Self", or "God" -- > all of these concepts are merely ways to formulate > an idea and a relationship to an idea, > more thoughts interpreted > against the background of other thoughts. > Similarly, saying there is "no one" who is doer > or cognizer simply contributes additional > thought-statements about reality, depending > as do other thoughts on a prior thought context for > meaning. > > Negating thoughts and concepts will never lead to It. > The activity of negating depends on something to be > negated. This very dependency doesn't allow This > with nothing prior to Itself to emerge from the > activities of negation. Similarly, inquiry is > dependent on a question being there, and meditation > is dependent on the context in which meditation has > meaning. That which has nothing beyond Itself will > never be found, constructed, nor recognized - > and neither inquiry nor meditation/contemplation > will lead to This. > > One may seek a teacher or spiritual path, but such > will only provide more sensation, thought, and > experience. > > One may seek to let go, but this activity will always > depend on there being something to let go. > > One may attempt to do nothing, but passivity will > have no power to interfere with thought seeking after > thought, experience leading to accumulation of > further experience, etc. > > Indeed, there cannot be shown to be anything "out there" > beyond sensation and thought that is being sensed and > thought about. Anything said to be "out there" > is a thought interpretation about sensory or > intuitive experience. The so-called "reality beyond" > or "reality out there" turns out to > be more data in the realm of concept and experience. > Thus, claims about "'Something' beyond thought > and sensation" are as absurd and paradoxical as > any other speech about This. > > When nothing is "placed 'out there'", there is nothing > "in here". > Then, nothing can be said to be or not to be. > Then, neither concepts of death, nor birth, nor > deathlessness, nor birthlessness apply. > > This is beyond any statements, activities, or inactivities. > Now is recognized the futility of any efforts > and non-efforts intended to find This, be This, > reveal This, or negate what is not This. > There is literally nothing else at this point > other than recognizing the utter futility of all > efforts and non-efforts, cognitions, feelings, > and experiences. > > As far as this statement itself being addtional > futile verbiage interpreted > in the context of prior words and ideas - it is so. > This statement itself cannot lead to "This" any more > than can any other statement, question, negation, or > assertion. Neither a path nor a pathless way of > being will reveal "This". > > -- Dan -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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