The Only Practice

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/1/00 8:13:58 AM, harsha-hkl writes:

 

<< What about the practice? What about equally detailed descriptions of

practices based on actual living experiences? What about detailed

descriptions of the many, many pitfalls along the way. What about the role

of things like attention, thought, memory, so-called awareness, so-called

consciousness, the psychological being, the I-sense and so on relative to

practice and the fact of delusion? What is REAL non-effort? What is the

consciousness of which everyone so elequently speak? Are we conscious? Is

there such a thing or state of being as consciousness? Do we perceive at

all? >>

 

Dear Moller,

 

Your earnest seeking touches me deeply. Conscious, yes, a very interesting

question, the consciousness seems to expand.

 

Perhaps a way to begin is to share our experiences. It seems to me to be

very important that we do this with gentleness and respect, for all, no

matter what their personal experiences and perspectives are...

 

Recently, this week actually, I had a very painful experience, and for the

first time in many years, spent time with waterfalls of tears. I feel very

fragile at the moment and just finished meditating, especially the heart

chakra, but I did not reach the core. A teacher of mine said, "oh, do this

and you will clear in about 10 minutes." Unfortunately the dragon didn't eat

the pain in ten minutes. I sought to transmute the emotions, to love,

because there truly is only love, but, I was unsuccessful, so, will try again

over the next few days.

 

This involves another person, and his pain is waking me up, so, in

meditation, I sought his higher self and requested permission to transmute.

 

I find that you are correct, that this inquiry may lead to many sincere

sharings of truths. If someone feels it necessary to come in and attack

another's thoughts, flame, "Teach" be the "Master" make fun, or some other

such nonsense, we will lose a valuable attempt at inquiry. We do not here

live in the slums where being "tough" is an asset. We perhaps could make

here a gentle Garden of Eden, to share fruits of love and peace and nurture

the flowers, the last rose, the fruits to harvest. The seed, love, Chokmah

brought into its full flowering and beauty of the Soul.

 

There are exceptionally gentle ones amongst us, who are able to perceive and

open doors, and sometimes we do this perhaps only in the mirror of another.

In isolation, we may believe whatever we wish about ourselves. Truly it is

only God or Divine's place to make such judgement, because you and I truly

don't know. But, in our love for each other, we are able to see insights

into another that we don't see in ourselves.

 

In the thousands of years we've incarnated, and in the millions upon

milllions of events which have brought us to Now, we cannot possibly know all

the permutations which have created for another, this moment in time, this

experience, so, it is not for me to judge where you are, nor you me, nor even

us of ourselves, this belongs solely and only to God. And, in our

compassion, and love, for one another we may perhaps seek some truth.

 

Gloria and I had a fascinating conversation last night, and in our search for

truth were able to see and be gentle and open windows and doors that we

cannot do by ourselves... "where two or three are gathered in My Name, there

I am in their midst."

 

Perhaps because we are women we are allowed more time in our emotions, and

then sometimes are able to see where blocks in various understandings and

chakras are... perhaps the men see this more on a mental level... I don't

know and I don't pretend to know, but an honest inquiry into the truth from

our own hearts and minds, may lead us to some interesting Lights.

 

Moller, your questions are very big, perhaps we could look at them one at a

time... ?

 

Love and Light,

just me

[Guest guest]

 

Advaita [Advaita]

Thursday, August 24, 2000 10:24 AM

Re: The Only Practice

 

 

Dear Victor,

 

Hi again to all my friends at Harshasatsangh.

 

I really enjoyed looking at the photo's of your retreat, trying to fit faces

to pre-conceived mental images of the names I have just seen on a computer

screen. A formiddible-looking group indeed!

 

Reagrding the posting by Joyce.

 

Of course it is VERY BEAUTIFULLY written and explained.

 

I was just wondering of what actual use such a refined kind of practice as

the one described could have for most people. This is really a type of

practice based on a very refinely integrated 'understanding' of things.

 

Such a description,offered to most people as a form of practice can be very

misleading. Unless one is capable of such subtle realisations which form

the basis of the practice suggested, the mind can only make images of the

things discussed and try to put these into practice. And without having

gone through the many preliminary practices offered by the Dzogchen

teachings. leading to a natural unfoldment of the non-state of Rigpa

(however faintly at first) self delusion is the only likely outcome, instEAd

of self-transcendence.

 

To my undestanding there is SO MUCH preliminary work to be done along this

path, and constant talk of the highest aspects of the non-dual teachings

could very easiliy remain just on the level of words, intellect and

delusion. I myself have often been guilty of talking higher than my actual

realization. This is easy, because one very easily mistakes the description

for the thing itself.

 

I find the current so-called debate around the Advaita teachings somewhat

superficial. The picture has been painted. The Western mind has hooked on

to the notions of the non-dualist realizers and came up with a very adequate

DESCRIPTION of the non-dual, non-state. But however good at describing the

thing, few are those who stand IN and AS the full realisation of that of

which they so adequately speak. Non-duality is easy to describe, but a

different animal to be realised - where realization means not the mental

clarity, but the actual living reality of the truth towards which the words

point.

 

What about the practice? What about equally detailed descriptions of

practices based on actual living experiences? What about detailed

descriptions of the many, many pitfalls along the way. What about the role

of things like attention, thought, memory, so-called awareness, so-called

consciousness, the psychological being, the I-sense and so on relative to

practice and the fact of delusion? What is REAL non-effort? What is the

consciousness of which everyone so elequently speak? Are we conscious? Is

there such a thing or state of being as consciousness? Do we perceive at

all?

 

Are these and many such questions merely to be brushed aside in view of the

clear 'understanding' of the description of non-dualism? Are we looking

for, and are we indeed even interested, in transformation? Or are we happy

just to repeat to one another the not incorrect statements ABOUT

non-dualism, and come to rest in the warmth of our mutual, delusiory

agreements?

 

Let me know if this line of discussion is of interest to you and other

members of this forum.

 

Love to all,

 

MOLLER DE LA ROUVIERE

 

Thank you Sri Moller-Ji! We remember you fondly here at a.

Nice to have you back. Perhaps you can tell us more about how your Project

is going (in Africa).

 

Lots of love

Harsha