Marcia/Gurdjieff/ Kundalini

[Guest guest]

Marcia Paul [jacpa]

Tuesday, April 20, 1999 2:01 PM

 

I just ran across something I find interesting in a

book of essays on Gurdjieff. This essay is by

Ravi Ravindra titled "Comparative Studies".

 

"In most religious and philosophic circles in India,

especially those fascinated by occult phenomena,

Kundalini is give a very high valuation. But Gurdjieff

has nothing positive to say about Kundalini. Having

undertaken, as he himself says, "To destroy, mercilessly,

without any compromises whatsoever, in the mentation and

feelings of the reader, the beliefs and views, by centuries

rooted in him, about everything existing in the world," he

ascribes to the suggestively parallel organ "kundabuffer" the

property of making human beings perceive reality topsy-

turvy. Ouspnesky quotes Gurdjieff as saying:

"In reality Kundalini is the power of imagination, the power

of fantasy, which takes the place of a real function....

Kundalini can act in all centers and with its help all the

centers can be satisfied with the imaginary instead of the

real...Kundalini is a force put into men in order to keep

them in their present state. If men could really see their

true position and could understand all the horror of it,

they would be unable to remain where they are even for

one second. They would begin to seek a way out and

they would quickly find it, because there is a way out;

but men fail to see it simply because they are hypnotized.

Kundalini is the force that keeps them in a hypnotic state.

"To awaken" for man means to be "dehypnotized."

 

As one recovers from the shock dealt by Gurdjieff's merciless

criticisms of one of the precious jewels of Indian philosophy,

one can begin to look at the tradition again. One discovers that

the most thorough and insightful authority on yoga, Patanjali,

the author of the celebrated Yoga Sutras, never mentions

Kundalini, and some of the very ancient and authoritative texts

on yoga, such as Yoga Yajnavalkya, regard Kundalini to be a

hindrance in the spiritual evolution of a person, an impediment

which needs to be removed in order to be touched and trans-

formed by the energy from Heaven. The human being is situated

along an axis stretched from Heaven to earth, and the proper

inner order demands a flow of energy (prana) from above

downwards. Naturally, the powers from below, entrenched and

coiled up in the organism as Kundalini, resist and try to block

the entry and movement of prana from above."

 

I have never studied Kundalini but I am curious as to what

anyone thinks if anything of the above quote.

 

Thanks.

 

Marcia

 

 

Harsha: Hi Marcia. Thanks for bringing this up. The above quote represents

one perspective. To the extent that such a perspective allows transcendence

(of all perspectives), it might have some value. Ouspnesky quotes Gurdjieff

as saying: "In reality Kundalini is the power of imagination, the power of

fantasy," etc. If we understand the nature of imagination in totality, then,

this is a true but a trivial insight. Where are we now? Are we not in

imagination right now? If through the arousal of Shakti, one has various

types of superconscious experiences, they might appear to be as real (or

more real) than the "ordinary perceptions and experiences". But such

experiences can rightly also be termed imagination. So we know that there is

imagination. Of that we are certain. Where there is imagination, there must

be an underlying screen on which imagination plays out or takes place. Where

there is imagination, there must be a hypothetical entity, one who

imagines. Where there is Shakti, there must be Shakta (Self). The Vedantins

say that the world is unreal as perceived but Real as Brahman. So one can

say that the Imagination is real and fantasy is natural as long as

Unconsciousness (veiling power of karma) dominates. When the Unconsciousness

evaporates, the principle of Imagination (Kundalini Shakti) melts into its

Source, the Self, Revealing It Self to be no different than the Self. This

is why we say that Self is Nirvikalpa (Beyond Imagination). Yet It Is Ever

Present and permeates all Imagination.

[Guest guest]

Hello Marcia:

 

Given that our entire life can be considered a play of imagination the

viewpoint of Gurdjieff is certainly as valid as any other. I believe that

part of the challenge in understanding the 'higher levels' of 'beingness' is

that there is so much ego and imagination attached to 'so-called' kundalini

experiences. I have heard people claiming to have achieved 'Nirvikalpa

Samadi' speak of all sorts of incredible experiences. While recounting

their 'experiences' so much of their ego was present that one knows they

were not in Nirvikalpa Samadi....afterall, would there really be anyone to

speak to if one had experienced the loss of one's sense of separation? In

my journeys I have met too many people with active kundalinis who were

hungry for whatever they felt they needed or were entitled to have....often

it appeared as if they were stuck in a sense of being special because they

have had kundalini experiences. On my own journey kundalini activity is part

of the process not the goal and I have found that when I do have an

experience generally I will be challenged quite heavily shortly afterwards.

There are so many who claim to be enlightened due to Mother Shakti's grace

and maybe I've just not met many enlightened folks but the few that I have

encountered seem to speak of love and surrender not kundalini.

 

Anyway, you asked for opinions :-).

 

Linda

 

> "In most religious and philosophic circles in India,

> especially those fascinated by occult phenomena,

> Kundalini is give a very high valuation. But Gurdjieff

> has nothing positive to say about Kundalini. Having

> undertaken, as he himself says, "To destroy, mercilessly,

> without any compromises whatsoever, in the mentation and

> feelings of the reader, the beliefs and views, by centuries

> rooted in him, about everything existing in the world," he

> ascribes to the suggestively parallel organ "kundabuffer" the

> property of making human beings perceive reality topsy-

> turvy. Ouspnesky quotes Gurdjieff as saying:

> "In reality Kundalini is the power of imagination, the power

> of fantasy, which takes the place of a real function....

> Kundalini can act in all centers and with its help all the

> centers can be satisfied with the imaginary instead of the

> real...Kundalini is a force put into men in order to keep

> them in their present state. If men could really see their

> true position and could understand all the horror of it,

> they would be unable to remain where they are even for

> one second. They would begin to seek a way out and

> they would quickly find it, because there is a way out;

> but men fail to see it simply because they are hypnotized.

> Kundalini is the force that keeps them in a hypnotic state.

> "To awaken" for man means to be "dehypnotized."

>

>

> I have never studied Kundalini but I am curious as to what

> anyone thinks if anything of the above quote.

>

> Thanks.

>

> Marcia

>

>

> //

>

> All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside

back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness.

Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is

where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal

Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously

arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a.

>

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