[ANetofJewels] Hmm?

[Guest guest]

-

"Victor Torrico" <vtorrico

; <ANetofJewels >

> Quoting Jessica <ellam-ondre:

>

> Hi Jessica,

>

> How is the state of conscious awareness apprehended? Is this

> possible? If you are this conscious awareness --- what are the

> implications of this?

>

> Yeah, I'm known as the "Ocean of Questions".

>

> Victor

>

Hi again Victor,

 

Don't know if my response to this is the "answer" that you are "looking"

for, but i'd like to attempt to share something from my heart and not my

head. I'd like to preface with: there is a realization that "i" am always

looking into a mirror. I responded to your earlier post, because it

reflected something back to "me".

 

Something in my "imagined" personal life led me to a place where i got to

experience "in the flesh" (not something read in books) that i was a

prisoner of my own mind. i was going insane; barely hanging on with my

bloody fingernails! Then sometime after, following the breakdown came the

dawning of Advaita and a quieting ensued. Still my mind was inquisitive,

"trying" to figure things out. Then it "seemed" as though there was

a"Magnet" drawing me into Silence. i 'appeared' to go through various stages

with this. My mind even viewed this as a further "prying off" of this world

and i was frightened. At first, i enjoyed hearing all of the information;

satisfied with that - for a time. But at the same time, Awareness was

shining on: "i" was avoiding; resisting letting go by keeping occupied

;entertained :distracted by being satisfied with the talking about it, but

not really. Silence kept pulling and "i" kept resisting. Even being involved

in these , Awareness was shining that "i" was often engaging in

activity, rather than "tuning in", so to speak, to the Silence. My mind -

still occupied;settling for words and concepts. But "something",

Silence/Awareness kept and keeps drawing me in.

 

Just heard Robert in satsang today - "one definition of the Self is a quiet

mind"

 

Victor, through your postings, you 'appear' to be pretty experienced in the

world of information on what is regarded as Dzogchen/ "one of higher

teachings" of Buddhism.

 

Any answer given to your question will only be more information/baggage,

more thoughts for the mind to wrap around. Awareness has shone that my mind

is not a friend. Don't know if any of this means anything to you but it's

what i was prompted to write.

 

Also, here is something taken from an earlier post here; an intro to the

Ribhu Gita -

 

"All practices should start with the inherent intuition that one is already

the Self. As the Self cannot be thought about or understood intellectually,

the Self itself must awaken which happens through practices that still the

mind. and reading and listening to the Truth, until the True "I", That which

enlightens the body/mind recognizes itself being referred to and a

spontaneous intuition of the Heart (Hrdayam) occurs, manifesting as a

Singularity that itself dissolves the mind and outshines the body. An

example of a text that Ramana Maharshi said would cause such a spontaneous

awakening is the Ribhu Gita, Chapter 26."

 

"The ego or separate soul is a concept. God, the world, the mind , desires,

action, sorrow and all other things are all concepts".

 

Ramana Maharshi

 

 

Much love to you, Victor.

 

~jessica

[Guest guest]

-

"Victor Torrico" <vtorrico

<ANetofJewels >;

>

Hello again Victor,

 

snip

 

You wrote:

.. I think that what I've heard

> over and over again, here and there, is that you cannot do it with the

> thinking mind

snip

 

Jess:

Knowledge is necessary in coming to understanding the Truth. Words &

concepts (thinking) are purposeful along the way, but at a

certain point in the journey, they can be a hindrance. Just more "stuff" for

the mind to "intellectually masturbate" with; obscuring Grace, Peace, Love

that is always present. Intellectually ~ understanding is easy enough, but

living it day to day, moment to moment is something else altogether. Please

forgive the redundancy, but a good measuring stick is to ask yourself how

long has it been since something last disturbed me? If something can still

disturb you, then there is still a sense of personal doership intact; still

a need for making effort (at quieting the mind). I don't think Ramesh gets

into this but......Robert, Ramana, and Nisargadatta , etc. do.

 

Victor:

and that one must dwell in the silence.

 

Jess:

That Silence, Grace, Love, Awareness is always shining forth, but just

obscured by

thinking, just like the sun that is temporaily obscured by the clouds. It is

always present. But as you say dwelling in that Silence ~ or ~ "tuning

into" or being in resonance with that silence;dwelling in that awareness

(peace) does not occur while the

mind/thoughts are doing their usual "monkey" antics; needing CONSTANT

entertainment, distraction, always moving from one thing to the other; never

satisfied, needing new stimulation or going to the complaint department.

 

Victor:

This I interpret as be out of your conceptual mind and simply dwell in pure

> awareness. Does it mean that thoughts will not arise

snip

 

Jess:

Thoughts continue to arise. But as they continue to arise and go away they

will return, maybe the same, maybe a variation on the theme, but that's the

nature of the mind; a conglomeration of thoughts;thinking. Mind is Maya.

 

Victor:

or that they may arise but are simply allowed to arise within the awareness

and allowed to simply go away?

 

Jess:

One could sit for aeons watching the thoughts. And watching thoughts makes

them weaker and weaker. What i learned from

Robert is that everything is preordained; the only freedom being to turn

within and not react to what is arising. Some thoughts are benign, so just

watching them can be all that is needed in that moment, but what about the

thoughts that are so intense or terrifying; creating somatic reactions that

make your heart pound or your head throb, or anger/rage to arise, etc. etc.?

How easy is it then to just watch? Sometimes that is not enough. Then what

does one do and how does one do this? Robert advocated anything that would

help to quiet the mind; whatever it took to get into the Silence. But he

said that Atma Vichara or self-enquiry is the most direct path ~ to

annhialate the mind. Like shooting ducks in a shooting gallery. No matter

what is arising, Your landlord evicts you! : ) Your husband/wife leaves you,

you lose all of your money. No matter what you are met with, no matter how

terrible, you meet it with Who Am I? I can remember when i first started

using it, crying through tears and with a wharble in my voice, pitifully

repeating Whooo Am iiiiiiiiiii? ha ha ho ho hee hee~ to the funny farm

: ) ! (Best to start practicing before the shit hits the fan! ( Just take

out the gun ~ Who Am I? ~ and shoot those suckers one by one ; ) !) But not

everyone is suited to this method. When I was first introduced to it, i did

not use it, watched my breath instead. But in the past year, it 'appears'

this is where this body/mind has been led/preordained to practice. And it's

a gift.

 

Victor:

> The sound files of Robert Adams satsanghs were very helpful in

> describing the mechanics to apply Ramana Maharshi's method of "Who am

> I". Guess I just have to fall back and regroup and be by myself for a

> while. There's just too too much stuff on the to keep up with

> and remain mindful. My mind just keeps getting pulled all over the

> place. Guess I'm just not stable enough to handle it.

>

Jess:

Egroups, tv, someone talking, boredom,bodily concerns, doesn't matter

what - the mind will use anything it can to prevent you from going there!

Understanding the nature of the mind is helpful along the way; coming to

understand how to "deal" with it; to use a method or methods to shut the

damn thing up!! : ) or annhialate it, is helpful along the way.

 

It will happen. "We're all hell-bound for heaven".

 

Victor:

May your life be full of love, laughter and peace,

 

Thank you Victor.

You are precious.

Namaste.

 

Love,

~jessica

 

 

 

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